Re: Paul McCartney urges PM to deliver hunt ban

From: A Pierrepoint (albert_at_hotmail.com)
Date: 09/09/04 

Date: Thu, 9 Sep 2004 12:49:46 +0000 (UTC)

"Martin Willett" <ignoredmailbox@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:2qao98Fs7dieU1@uni-berlin.de...
> A ban on hunting was in the manifesto of the party with a
> parliamentary majority, that party is well within its rights to force >
the vote

Are you saying that everyone who votes for a party, any party, agrees 100%
with every last dot and comma in their manifesto? I doubt this is true for
most people, they vote for the party whose views they 'generally' support,
it does not mean they give carte blanche to everything - though politicians
would have you believe they do.

> There is nothing dishonest in reporting the findings of opinion polls,
> especially if they are genuine and their nature is fully disclosed. It
> is complete pompous windbagggery to claim that only a >referendum can
reveal the view of the people.

Opinion polls have their uses but they can be 'fixed' by using loaded
questions, selected interviewees etc. There can be no doubt that a
referendum will reveal the will of the people with far more accuracy that
any opinion poll.

> It is the job of Parliament to consider the issues and make these
> decisions and to interpret what is best for the country rather than
> simply follow every whim of the people, no matter how >inconsistent those
whims are.

Wrong, it is the duty of politicians to obey the will of the people -
otherwise it is not a democracy.

>Referendums are unpopular with parliamentarians

That's because they are afraid that the people will want something the
politicians don't want to give them.

> There is no need
> to put either capital punishment or fox hunting to a referendum
> because all the main parties regard them as matters for the personal
> conscience of MPs

Yes there is, these are not everyday matters that we can leave the
politicians to get on with. Everyday matters don't need 'personal
conscience' to be taken into account. An MP is elected by constituents to
look after the interests of constituents (his/her party line should come
second to this). No 'personal conscience' vote should be allowed in
parliament. If it's that serious, the people should be allowed to decide -
otherwise it's not democracy is it?

> referendums are only called over issues that
> parties want to unite over, but can't, and/or matters which
> fundamentally affect the constitution.

Well why won't they have a referendum on capital punishment then? Bringing
it back would surely affect the constitution wouldn't it?

> He (grandfather) sorted out his fox problems himself. The foxes
> either ran away for a hundred yards or so and sat and laughed at
> him or got shot dead on the spot.

He must have been a crackshot, the foxes either died instantly or got away
unhurt (that's the same argument fox hunters make you know). I don't
suppose such a marksman ever missed a bit and just wounded the fox, which
then went off and died in agony over a period of days. But enough now,
otherwise it may appear that I'm trying to defend fox hunting, and that is
not my intention, I am trying to defend democracy.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: All you hunters out there:
    ... Cheney incident Saturday. ... of safe hunting evolved over the years, or was it in fact Cheney's ... to the party if you've wandered off. ... the friggin' bird he'd just shot. ...
    (rec.sport.football.college)
  • Re: All you hunters out there:
    ... Cheney incident Saturday. ... of safe hunting evolved over the years, or was it in fact Cheney's ... to the party if you've wandered off. ... the friggin' bird he'd just shot. ...
    (rec.sport.football.college)
  • Re: All you hunters out there:
    ... Cheney incident Saturday. ... of safe hunting evolved over the years, or was it in fact Cheney's ... to the party if you've wandered off. ... the friggin' bird he'd just shot. ...
    (rec.sport.football.college)
  • Re: All you hunters out there:
    ... Cheney incident Saturday. ... of safe hunting evolved over the years, or was it in fact Cheney's ... to the party if you've wandered off. ... the friggin' bird he'd just shot. ...
    (rec.sport.football.college)
  • Re: All you hunters out there:
    ... Cheney incident Saturday. ... of safe hunting evolved over the years, or was it in fact Cheney's ... to the party if you've wandered off. ... the friggin' bird he'd just shot. ...
    (rec.sport.football.college)