Re: AI vaccination approved for EU


" Jill" <newsNOSPAM@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:1140651201.28088.0@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
PammyT wrote:
Perhaps there is some way small scale poultry keepers could band
together and force the government to allow us to vaccinate our flocks
since we do not export our birds and trade would not therefore be
affected?

Have you read Prof Pennington on the use of this vaccine?
no
Have you seen that this is not a vaccine against H5N1 but only against H2
types?
Yes but it must surely be possible to produce the vaccine against H5

Have you read about this vaccination masking the infection so that there
is
no way to tell what is happening and the ramifications of that situation?
Yes but I beleive this is government propoganda.

That there is no clear test to tell the difference between infected and
vaccinated?
That there is no proof that this vaccine works to protect birds for any
length of time?

The fact that there is no proof is not conclusive evidence that it will not
protect birds, it only means that it has not been deemed important enought o
research so none was done. It's cheaper to kill chickens and pay a pittance
in compensation than to help breeders of rare breeds and purebred poultry to
be able to vaccinate their birds.

- this problem is going to be with us for years to come.
So lobby for better research into an effective vaccine such as exists for
human flu.

Have you not seen that its the industry in France and Holland that wants
the
vaccine?
Its fine - they will not have birds aline long enough for it to be a
problem
So you say. It is still conjecture.

If you want your birds to live through the next few years of autumn
migrations maybe this is not the best option?
I want a 'belt and braces' option. My birds under cover *and* vaccinated.
I shall have to kill my Sebastopol geese as I have nowhere to confine them.

The only places who have remained clean of H5N1 despite constant infected
migratory birds are those who have dealt swiftly and cleanly with
outbreaks
and have not vaccinated - mainly of note South Korea and Japan
Do you know how much it costs?
Pennies apparently. £12 for a 1000 birds.
How do you propose to vaccinate EVERY bird in the country?
I never said I wanted every bird vaccinated. Those living in battery and
grower sheds will not ever come into contact with wild buirds. I simply want
the *option* to vaccinate my own birds at my own expense if I choose.

What about precious
lines, carefully bred for for decades?

Unfortunately in 2006 there are very very few with true clean lines left
and
those that are, are just about scunnered with it all
I know several breeders with pure lines. One chap of 90 years old has kept
this particular breed for over 60 years. The loss of his birds would have
enormous ramifications on that particular breed.
Of no importance at all in the grand scheme of things, my own cochins are
irreplaceable to me. My blue strain in particular has been with me for
around 10 years. I know my birds, what temperaments they have, what colours
they are likely to throw. A new bird is csarefully introduced to compliment
my breeding. Not important to you or the government I know but if I lost my
whole flock of birds, mentally it would finish me. Will they also kill all
my parrots who share aviaries with some of the bantams and who never come
into contact with wild birds? If not why not since they too will carry the
virus.
As usual the government is simply whistling into the wind and hope that
nobody notices that they have no idea. They don't offer proper guidance and
advice. We have to try to glean what we can from the internet and watch what
other countries are doing.
Shambolic is a word which springs to mind and I will be sharpening my
pitchfork tines because they will not kill my birds without a fight. I will
have great pleasure in making at least one of the bastards bleed.

Perhaps we should be lobbying
our MP's to allow us to vaccinate even if it means the commercially
produced birds and the like don't have vaccination.

Everyone may need to read up about how this is all working and who is
wanting to vaccinate and why.
Read up if the data has not been influenced by parliament leaning on the
scientists to provide the evidence it wants.

You may also want to read up about how this virus is likely to affect the
UK -- very differently to the rest of the EU and therefore each person
assess their own risk
Bear in mind that we have only a few thousand waterfowl migrants coming to
the UK this spring - from unaffected areas so far known. -- Unlike some of
the continental Europe
Even next autumn when the smelly stuff may well hit the spinney thing as
all
the waterfowl who winter here will have had the chance to meet up and be
pally with migrants from infected areas in their summer breeding grounds
of
the Baltic to the Arctic will be on their way back - we need to know where
the infected birds land up if we are not going to have this as a year
round
problem
Maybe enclosing our birds for a short time each autumn - particularly
around
the hot spots of migrants which will show up over the next few autumns -
is
a small price to pay in comparison to having a rolling infection that we
lose control of in this country. This virus is nasty - its mutating fast
and
its is not one we want to have as an endemic in our wild bird populations
threatening everyones chickens , and pigs and ultimately to a lesser or
greater respect other mammals including outselves

How will the large waterfol breeders cope with confining all their stock?
What about free range pig breeders? It isn't simply about my or you covering
the runs of our couple of hundred chickens. The sooner a reliable vaccine is
produced for *all* species, the better.
BTW there is a vaccination available against the AIDS visrus. A morning
after pill type thing for those at risk. Why is the WHO or similar not
throwing billions into finding an effective anti viral drug. If an infected
person or animal could be given such a thing the risks would be smaller.
It is simply all about trade, and money. It is cheaper to kill everything
than to develop anti virals or an effective vaccine.

I am not pro or anti vaccination at this point -- there is simply not
enough
known about the vaccine or the virus to be able to certain of the future.
However the cons are tipping the balance over the pros right now.
Only if you are gullible enough to believe what DEFRA and the government
tells you.


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