apiths ate sedges etc. in riverbanks, swamps & lagoons (Re: Is the AAH a legitimate hypothesis? Of course it is.

From: Marc Verhaegen (fa204466_at_skynet.be)
Date: 01/30/05 

Date: Sun, 30 Jan 2005 09:19:16 +0100

The dry apers are as usual twisting the data in order to make everything fit
into their dry savanna.
The dry facts:
Sponheimer & Lee-Thorp say "sedges" etc.
Where are sedges found?
:-)
Yes, in reed & papyrus marshes, mudflats, swamps, lagoons etc., exactly
where apiths are found, eg,
- ER-17000 & -16005: Walker cs.1986: A.aethiopicus was discovered near the
boundary between overbank deposits of large perennial river and alluvial fan
deposits, amid water-& reedbucks.
- Lake Turkana: Conroy 1990: "The lake margins were generally swampy, with
extensive areas of mudflats... A.boisei was more abundant in fluvial
environments, whereas H.habilis was rare in such environments...
Australopithecus fossils are more common than Homo both in channel and
floodplain deposits. The gracile hominids... seem to be more restricted
ecologically to the lake margin than are the robust forms."
- Chesowanja A.boisei: Carney cs.1971: "The fossiliferous sediments were
deposited in a lagoon... Abundant root casts... suggest that the embayment
was flanked by reeds and the presence of calcareous algae indicates that the
lagoon was warm and shallow. Bellamya and catfish are animals tolerant of
relatively stagnant water..."
- Olduvai middle Bed I: Conroy 1990: "...swamp vegetation is indicated by
abundant vertical roots channels and casts possibly made by some kind of
reed. Fossil rhizomes of papyrus also suggest the presence of marshland
and/or shallow water." Puech 1992: "Cyperaceae fruits were common in
H.habilis habitat (Bonnefille, 1984). Ancient Egyptians ate Cyperus papyrus
root which was also present at Olduvai in swamp-margins and river banks."

See, eg, Marc Verhaegen & Pierre-François Puech 2000 "Hominid Lifestyle and
Diet Reconsidered: Paleo-Environmental and Comparative Data" Hum.Evol.15:
151-162: It is traditionally believed that human ancestors evolved in a warm
and dry environment. The available evidence, however, favours the vision
that it happened in a warm and wet environment. The paleo-environmental
data suggest that the early australopithecines Australopithecus anamensis,
afarensis and africanus lived in warm, moist, and wooded landscapes such as
gallery forests. In the Pleistocene, the robust australopithecines
A.robustus and boisei seem to have dwelt in more open, possibly cooler and
generally dryer places, in the vicinity of shallow and relatively stagnant
waters of lakesides, lagoons, marshes and riverbanks. Dental and microwear
studies suggest that the australopithecines, more than Western lowland
gorillas, regularly fed on aquatic herbaceous vegetation (AHV). ...

Note: that apiths dwelt in swamps & ate sedges & AHV has nothing to do with
Homo evolution, which happened along the sea coasts (AAT).

Marc Verhaegen
http://www.onelist.com/community/AAT
http://allserv.rug.ac.be/~mvaneech/Verhaegen.html

________

"Ross Macfarlane" <rmacfarl@alphalink.com.au> wrote in message
news:1107044613.039236.223920@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
>
> Kaz wrote:
>> "Philip Deitiker" <Donevenask@worlnet.att.net> wrote in message
>> news:9wDHd.4241$8u5.2566@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
>> > range, or even the subset that leads to us. What it does say
> however,
>> > is so far there is substantively more in-situ evidence for
> expanding
>> > into savanah than into aquatic. It does not mean that humans were
>> > strcitly savannah dwellers.
>>
>> And what is this in-situ evidence?
>
> Carbon-13 isotopic analysis of the fossil teeth of Australopithecus
> africanus, which indicates that they derived their food mainly from a
> grassland environment. Try a Google search on Sponheimer and Lee-Thorp
> - see for example:
>
> http://www.crystalinks.com/earlyhumanoids4.html
>
> "
> Grasses and related plants known as sedges use a different form of
> photosynthesis that is more likely to absorb carbon dioxide with the
> heavier carbon-13. Thus, grasses and sedges contain more carbon-13
> atoms than other plants. Animals that eat grasses and sedges likewise
> have higher carbon-13 levels than those eating fruits and other plants.
> What Sponheimer and Lee-Thorp found was that the teeth of A. africanus
> had an in-between amount carbon-13 ? more than the fruit eaters,less
> than the grass eaters. Which meant not only they're eating fruits,
> they're eating a lot of grasses, or animals eating grasses. The lower
> carbon-13 levels could also come from eating certain types of insects.
> "
>>
>> > How can I make the ape theorist of this world understand. Science
>> > is not about knowing, its about asking and waiting for answers.
>>
>> Hmmm...except that this isn't the impression one gets from the
> scientific
>> establishment. Consider the conclusive tone of the reactionaries
> claiming
>> the AAH is definitely false.
>
> Most of those who are giving you a skeptical reaction around here
> aren't knee-jerk reactionaries. We don't claim the AAH is definitely
> false - there are any number of posts already in the SAP archive saying
> that we don't a priori assume that it's wrong. It's the arguments put
> forward by AAH supporters - arguments based on inadequate or downright
> false evidence, faulty logic, and circular reasoning - that we take
> issue with.
>
> Or to put it another way:
>
> I have said it before, and I will say it again: the best argument I've
> yet seen for why the AAH must be wrong is the quality of the arguments
> made by those who believe it is right...
>
> Ross Macfarlane
>

Relevant Pages

  • Re: coastal footprints 124 ka
    ... that apiths probably had sedges in their diet, of course - what else my boy? ... Tooth microwear studies indicate that Australopithecus afarensis molar ... The microwear of Australopithecus ... Apparently, an early australopith diet ...
    (sci.anthropology.paleo)
  • Re: coastal footprints 124 ka
    ... that apiths probably had sedges in their diet, of course - what else my boy? ... Tooth microwear studies indicate that Australopithecus afarensis molar ... The microwear of Australopithecus ... Apparently, an early australopith diet ...
    (sci.anthropology.paleo)
  • A.robustus ate sedges?
    ... carnivory; eating leaves and shoots of forbs and woody plants; and eating ... quantities of carbon-13-enriched foods such as grasses and sedges or animals ... that ate these plants, or both"29. ...
    (sci.anthropology.paleo)