Re: olfaction (Re: skinny runners

Marc Verhaegen wrote:
>
> "Rich Travsky" <" traRvEsky"@hotmMOVEail.com> wrote in message
> news:4323C7E9.511E3FB3@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>
> > > Travsky seems to believe that human have a better sense of smell than
> chimps.
>
> > I said no such Marc. Quit lying. I posted about a report showing our sense
> of smell is not so reduced after all.
>
> Then inform a little bit, my boy.

Then quit lying, Marc.

> 1) http://www.berkeley.edu/news/media/releases/2005/08/29_smell.shtml Why
> you believe we should be unable to smell directions?? Don't you turn your
> head when you smell something?

Where did I say we're "unable to smell directions"? Stop lying.

> 2) Our olfaction is very much reduced compared to chimps. Anatomical
> evidence: our olf.bulb is ~40 % or theirs. Less than half, Travsky. Had
> you expected that if a species moved to the plains??

The Berkeley study shows we're better smellers than thought. No comparisions
with primates in the link.

> 3) DNA evidence: AG Clark AG cs.2003 "Inferring nonneutral evolution from
> human-chimp-mouse orthologous gene trios" Science 302:1960-3 ... Of those
> human genes that have a known function, about half of the total, nearly 50
> are linked to smell. Many of them seem to be decaying into uselessness,
> probably reflecting the lesser importance of smell in our lifestyle rel.to
> that of chimpanzees.
> Decaying into uselessness... Enough said? Why "decaying into uselessness"?
> Because they don't have to smell meat on your savanna?? :-D

The Berkeley study shows the decay to be exaggerated.

> Travsky, throw away your savanna nonsense. At 1.8 Ma we find Homo remains
> from Java to Algeria. Do you really believe they went these 15,000 km over
> some savanna?? If you simply assume they followed the coasts (what else??),
> why shouldn't they have eaten shellfish? Why shouldn't they have evolved a
> panniculus adiposus? Why couldn't they have lost their fur? Why not
> developed a larger brain? More handiness? More stone tool use? No more
> aligned body build? No reduced olfaction?

Marc, throw away your water crap. They walked over the world and are found
all over the world in places where there are no beaches.

> If OTOH you believe they went to some savanna (what savanna at Java??), they
> should have evolved a faster speed, larger teeth, less dependance on
> drinking-water, higher tolerable body temperatures, higher daily temperature
> fluctuations etc.etc. We see nothing of all this. ZERO. NADA. It's clear
> that the fossils you claim "lived on the savanna" ventured there along
> rivers, lakes, swamps...

We see no evidence whatsoever of your just so story littoral lifestyle. Not
even archaeological evidence, and yet, we have LOTS of that for land living.

Sorry.


> > > Just tell us, my boy, why you believe that olfactory reduction is
> required
> > > for running over your savanna.
> >
> > Who said it's required???? I don't, and the study I refer to below shows
> > the reduction is not really as much as thought.
> >
> > > Or just tell us why you believe that being able to smell directions
> > > contradicts AAT??
> >
> > You're the one making the claims of reduction aiding your scenario.
> >
> > > "Rich Travsky" <" traRvEsky"@hotmMOVEail.com> wrote in message
> > > news:431BCAE2.E44F6EF2@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > > Marc Verhaegen wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > "Rich Travsky" <" traRvEsky"@hotmMOVEail.com> wrote in message
> > > > > news:430EA29F.7D2CFE83@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > > >
> > > > > > > Travsky, once again you fail to grasp what it's all about: if
> humans
> > > ran
> > > > > over the plains as you believe, then why would we be different from
> > > savanna
> > > > > chimps IYO?? Do you really believe that our olfaction diminished
> > > because we
> > > > > "ran to spread across the world.." :-D Think a bit, my boy.
> > > > >
> > > > > > Once again you fail to grasp anything. Humans can walk AND run.
> > > > >
> > > > > I know, my boy, I know.
> > > >
> > > > Good, my boy.
> > > >
> > > > > > Savanna chimps are still chimps - not humans.
> > > > >
> > > > > I know, my boy, I know.
> > > >
> > > > Good, my boy.
> > > >
> > > > > > And diminished olfactory ability has nothing to do with walking or
> > > > > running.
> > > > >
> > > > > Did you say that perhaps??
> > > >
> > > > Why would you think there's a connection? ;)
> > > >
> > > > > :-D Think a bit, my boy. Esp. about why our olfaction is so mluch
> > > worse
> > > > > than the chimp's.
> > > >
> > > > Not seen the latest?
> > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > Study shows humans have ability to track odors, much like bloodhounds
> > > > 29 August 2005
> > > >
> > > > BERKELEY - Though humans may never match the tracking ability of
> dogs, we
> > > > apparently have the ability to sniff out and locate odors, according
> to a
> > > > new study by scientists from the University of California, Berkeley.
> > > >
> > > > Student volunteers presented with odors to one nostril or the other
> could
> > > > reliably discern where the odor was coming from, and functional
> magnetic
> > > > resonance images of their brains showed that the brain is set up to
> pay
> > > > attention to the difference between what the left and right nostrils
> > > sense,
> > > > much the way it can localize sounds by contrasting input from the
> ears.
> > > >
> > > > "It has been very controversial whether humans can do egocentric
> > > > localization, that is, keep their head motionless and say where the
> > > spatial
> > > > source of an odor is," said study coauthor Noam Sobel, associate
> > > professor
> > > > of psychology at UC Berkeley and a member of the campus's Helen Wills
> > > > Neuroscience Institute. "It seems that we have this ability and that,
> > > with
> > > > practice, you could become really good at it."
> > > > ...
> > > > Porter, Sobel and their colleagues reported the results in the August
> 18
> > > > issue of the journal Neuron.
> > > >
> > > > In a review appearing in the same issue of the journal, Jay A.
> Gottfried
> > > of
> > > > the Department of Neurology at Northwestern University's Feinberg
> School
> > > of
> > > > Medicine noted that the UC Berkeley findings open numerous avenues
> for
> > > > further research. "Finally, what are the implications for the
> Provençal
> > > > truffle hunt?" he wrote, only partly tongue-in-cheek. "In the
> traditional
> > > > world of the truffle forests, the dog (or pig) is king. The evidence
> > > > presented here suggests that humans are every bit as well equipped to
> > > carry
> > > > out the search."
> > > > ...
> > > >
> > > > > > > "Rich Travsky" <" traRvEsky"@hotmMOVEail.com> wrote in message
> > > > > > > news:430169D9.AB7771FE@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > > > > > > Marc Verhaegen wrote:
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > "Lee Olsen" <paleocity@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
> > > > > > > > >
> news:1123857405.885842.108700@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >>>> I can't outrun anything, Nick, and I don't see why I
> should
> > > be
> > > > > > > capable
> > > > > > > > > of this.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >>> http://tinyurl.com/7u5wo "In fact, he walked and ran
> with
> > > better
> > > > > > > > > mechanics than we do today. The mechanics of his femur,
> femur
> > > head,
> > > > > > > pelvis,
> > > > > > > > > and lower back are superior to those of today. We have had
> to
> > > > > sacrifice
> > > > > > > some
> > > > > > > > > of that efficiency of walking and running to give birth to
> > > children
> > > > > with
> > > > > > > > > larger brains."
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >> Don't believe this just-so interpretation: the Boy had
> longer
> > > > > femoral
> > > > > > > > > necks than we have, heavier bones etc.,
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > And along with the heavier bones, heavier muscles attached
> to
> > > them
> > > > > for
> > > > > > > > > better support as the URL says. Look at Ben Johnson
> > > > > > > > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ben_Johnson_(athlete)
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Was this Ben Johnson no short-distance runner? ie, the
> opposite
> > > of
> > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > slender Kenyan long-distance runners? Cursorial mammals
> don't
> > > have
> > > > > thick
> > > > > > > > > bones, Lee!
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Humans can do both.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Why do you think he wanted to bulk-up by using drugs? The
> > > Turkana
> > > > > Boy
> > > > > > > > > didn't have to do this, he was born that way. Born to run.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Nonsense: if he was born to run, he had had very slender
> bones:
> > > see
> > > > > > > horse
> > > > > > > > > skeleton! He hadn't had plantigrady (more than chimps!). He
> > > hadn't
> > > > > had
> > > > > > > long
> > > > > > > > > & rel.horizontal femoral necks. Etc. There's *nothing* in
> the
> > > > > H.erectus
> > > > > > > > > skeleton that suggests they ran a lot:
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > We're not horses. Our ancestors walked and ran to spread
> across
> > > the
> > > > > world.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Born to Swim?
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Nope. We live on *land*, not in water. We can run, walk,
> climb -
> > > land
> > > > > > > > activities. The vast majority of humans who live near water
> will
> > > spend
> > > > > on
> > > > > > > > a little amount of time actually IN the water, if at all.
.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: SFs have poor olfactory
    ... evident fact that humans can survive and hunt on the ... savanna without a good sense of smell: ... developing an excellent sense of smell. ... Cheetahs, leopards, and lions do not hunt by smell. ...
    (sci.anthropology.paleo)
  • Re: smell of savannah
    ... They researched what is the most annoying smell for ... Huumans - and their ancestors - live on the savanna and did for some time. ... distant past the *personal* likes and dislikes of a few current humans. ... The very fact that we lived in savanna is of most importance. ...
    (sci.anthropology.paleo)
  • Re: smell of savannah
    ... They researched what is the most annoying smell for ... Huumans - and their ancestors - live on the savanna and did for some time. ... distant past the *personal* likes and dislikes of a few current humans. ... The very fact that we lived in savanna is of most importance. ...
    (sci.anthropology.paleo)
  • Re: smell of savannah
    ... They researched what is the most annoying smell for ... Huumans - and their ancestors - live on the savanna and did for some time. ... distant past the *personal* likes and dislikes of a few current humans. ... The very fact that we lived in savanna is of most importance. ...
    (sci.anthropology.paleo)
  • Re: olfaction (Re: skinny runners
    ... of smell is not so reduced after all. ... Less than half, Travsky. ... throw away your savanna nonsense. ... >>> Study shows humans have ability to track odors, ...
    (sci.anthropology.paleo)