Re: running without salt & water

On Apr 18, 12:00 pm, Marc Verhaegen <m_verhae...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Op 17-04-2007 15:14, in artikel
1176815694.630060.286...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, Lee Olsen
<paleoc...@xxxxxxxxxxx> schreef:

On Apr 16, 11:38 pm, Daud.De...@xxxxxxxxx wrote:
On Apr 16, 2:04 pm, "Lee Olsen" <paleoc...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
On Apr 16, 12:34 pm, Marc Verhaegen <m_verhae...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Op 16-04-2007 03:13, in artikel
1176686017.674623.238...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, Lee Olsen
<paleoc...@xxxxxxxxxxx> schreef:
On Apr 15, 3:58 am, Marc Verhaegen <m_verhae...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
http://scienceblogs.com/bushwells/2007/01/marathon_runners_and_na_na_...
http://www.naturalhistorymag.com/master.html?http://www.naturalhistor...
1206/1206_samplings.html

...

Some people even go to the moon.  Does that mean our ancestors lived there?
Do you find cut-marks on antelope bones on the moon  from 2.6 Ma  like
you find on the savanna ?

All next to rivers.

False.


Most likely drowned or trampled when crossing rivers
during the trek. (I'm not claiming no hominid lived near rivers in savannas
etc.)

Who cares about dead-end hominids? I'm talking about early Homo.

Some butcheries (SE.Asia IIRC) show traces of shells used to butcher them.
Also savanna?

Yeah? Just what were they butchering, antelope?


Nobody claims some people kill antelopes.

(Did I say that?  I forgot "not"?)

Whatever.... cut marks are on antelope bones, OK?

But the fact remains, early Homo was utilizing antelope bones on the
savanna 2.6 Ma, long before we got to the moon. So yes, our ancestors
lived on the savanna.
 The point is that humans are superior to most typical savanna
dwellers:

Humans are superior to most typical polar dwellers, to most typical
forest-dwellers, most typical mountain-climbers etc.etc.

True, but mountains, polar etc. lack 2.6 My fossil/tool sites so are
irrelevant to Homo evolution.

 "The earliest Eurasians preferentially occupied
grasslands and open scrub- and wood-lands, as in
East Africa. Homo  ergaster/erectus in East Africa after 1.7 Ma is
associated with hot and dry conditions, and open
grasslands;

Nobody denies the Pleistocene was generally more open & cold & dry, but that
does not mean that H.er lived on the open plains rather than at the
waterside!

The first stone tools are found in association with antelope,
tortoises (desert????), and ostrich bones. None of which require
living at waterside locations. Some antelope don't need to drink from
a water source, they can live off water from the leaves and grass.


Heh, heh....Dennell page 288 (Early Human Behaviour in Global Context
1998): "It has been pointed out that the African grasslands were
occupied by hominids at least 3.5 mya, and that these grasslands then
extended without interruption across most of Asia."


RW Dennell cs.1988 "Early tool-making in Asia: two-million-year-old
artefacts in Pakistan" Antiquity 62:98­106 ...  Most early hominid fossils
in Eurasia are highly fragmentary, usu.occur in water-lain sediments ...

The
spatial associations betw.artifacts & animal bones in the earliest sites
(most occur in open fluvial, lacustrine or marsh deposits) are difficult to
interpret ...  A few of the medium-sized & smaller ungulate-bones display
traces of marrow-processing, probably but not certainly made by hominids;
other items were gnawed by large or small carnivores , some were rolled by
water & abraded by waterborne sediments. ... The argument that early
hominids regularly hunted giant mammals is not well supported by the
available evidence ...

RW Dennell 2003 "Dispersal & colonisation, long & short chronologies: how
continuous is the Early Pleistocene record for hominids outside East
Africa?" JHE 45:421-440 ... appears to have preferred mosaic environments
that also contained permanent water & some wood- or scrubland, as well as
grasslands.  ... The earliest evidence for hominids N of the Sahara is Ain
Hanech 36°N. The locality was situated in a flood-plain; grassland is
indicated by remains of Equus & gazelle, and open water by Hippo. ... In
theKashafrud Basin 36°N in NE.Iran, Oldowan-type stone artefacts were found
in the palaeo-shore deposits of a vast shallow Late Plio/Early Pleist.lake

Of course, water is were fossils do fossilize. Fossils only make up a
tiny fraction of the sites where tools are found. IOW, fossils bias
the record.


... Dmanisi Š probably only 60 km from the Caspian, which may then have
joined the Black Sea ... Pollen analysis indicates increasing aridity after
the hominid occupation ...

"only" ???? "may have then"????? Typical mammals from Asia and Africa
are found there, no evidence of any shell middens, sorry.

Anyway, Dmanisi is dated almost a million years after the first stone
tools are found in association with antelope, tortoises (desert????),
and ostrich bones.



its post-cranial anatomy, with its long
limbs was geared to long-distance walking across
open ground, and to heat dispersal through upright
posture (Dennell 2003:442)."

Where does he get that??

From Leakey and Walker.

This is nonsense: what mammals walk upright to
dissipate heat across open ground??  :-D   Besides, the birds with rel.the
longest limbs are wading birds.

The first stone tools are found in association with antelope,
tortoises (desert????), and ostrich bones. This suggests mostly arid
or at least a savanna climate. Tools prove they were there, but there
is no evidence at all as to where they were exactly living.
http://www.naturalhistorymag.com/master.html?http://www.naturalhistor
1206/1206_samplings.html







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