Re: Did the Trojan war really happen the way Homer said it did?

From: Franz Gnaedinger (frgn_at_bluemail.ch)
Date: 09/09/04 

Date: 8 Sep 2004 23:44:38 -0700

frgn@bluemail.ch (Franz Gnaedinger) wrote in message news:<2bf25455.0409072253.270a9f6@posting.google.com>...

Field 12 on the Elaia side of the Phaistos Disk, Evans 13 8 29,
Ohlenroth I P I (iota pi iota), yields IPI of ENIIPI

   http://www.seshat.ch/home/tiryns.GIF

Evans 13, Ohlenroth I (iota), shows a tree and refers to itea
= willow tree. The willow provides shadow, its twigs can be used
for making baskets, and as the olive trees resemble the willow
trees the latter might well have been sacred to the vegetation
goddess of old. The same tree signs appear on the gold signet
ring from Tiryns. The oval is a little more than five centimeters
wide, the tree signs have practically the same size as on the
Phaistos Disk, they are even slightly smaller than on the disk:

   http://www.seshat.ch/home/ring.gif

Evans 8, Ohlenroth P (pi), shows a glove and refers to penta
= five, and pan = all. The glove is the emblem of male power,
as explained in two previous messages (T 25, E 5 10 13).

Evans 23, Ohlenroth I (iota), shows again the head of a pig
and refers to hieron (beginning with an aspirated iota) =
sacrificial animal, sacrifice, place of oracle, omen,
sanctuary, service, act in a service. It would be a pig
sacrificed by the king of Tiryns or one of his four ministers
in honor of the vegetation goddess.

Next time: field E 14 (as field E 13 had already been bespoken)

Regards Franz Gnaedinger

> Field E 10 had been bespoken together with the fields E 2 and
> E 13, so we may now proceed to E 11.
>
> Field 11 on the Elaia side of the Phaistos Disk, Evans 7 (with
> a thorn) 45 29, Ohlenroth E_ N I (epsilon_ ny iota), yields
> ENI of ENIIPE
>
> http://www.seshat.ch/home/tiryns.GIF
>
> Evans 7 (with a thorn), Ohlenroth E_ (epsilon_), shows an oven
> as reference to Demeter, here Black Demeter Melaina, the Arcadian
> Elaia.
>
> Evans 45, Ohlenroth N (ny), shows a wave and refers to nausiporos
> = navigable, evoking Poseidon, originally the god of the rivers,
> then also of the seas. Furthermore, Poseidon was the creator of
> the horse. When Odysseus leaves pleasant Scherie, the ships
> start like horses. Also the ship or boat of the Cretan Elaia
> is a horse, as shown on the gold ring from Mokhlos:
>
> http://www.seshat.ch/home/elaia.GIF
>
> Evans 29, Ohlenroth I (iota), shows the head of a pig and refers
> to hieron (beginning with an aspirated iota) = sacrifical animal,
> sacrifice, place of oracle, omen, sanctuary, service, act in a
> service. The pig is getting sacrificed in order to obtain the
> oracle of the priestess of Despoina, daughter of Black Demeter
> Melaina in the guise of a mare and Poseidon in the guise of
> a stallion. Despoina means mistress; her secret name was Nyx
> meaning night. Her presence in field E 11 may be indicated by
> the thorn emphasizing the emblem of her mother Black Demeter
> Melaina.
>
> Field E 10 is nearly identical with field T 29 on the other
> side of the disk (on the other disk, for the Phaistos Disk
> is actually a pair of disks baked together, which is proved
> by a fine groove along the rim). In field E 10 the pig will
> be sacrificed, in field T 29 it has been sacrificed, as
> the head is turned upside down. The occurrence of the same
> constellation on both side or disks alludes, I believe,
> to an oracle eponymous Tiryns received in Elaia's grove at
> Phigalia. There might have been a famine in the Argolis,
> whereupon a priestess of Nyx might have advised eponymous
> Tiryns as follows: Irrigate the fields, but look to it
> that the River Manesse dosn't overflow and devastate them;
> plant grains and olives; and behave like the bees that are
> producing honey and are also willing to defend their own.
> She would have broken a twig from the sacred olive tree
> in Elaia's grove and given it to eponymous Tiryns, king
> of the Argolis, and instructed him as to how cultivate
> olives, and that is why an olive twig appears in the
> entrance field of the Tiryns side. In Homer's Odyssey,
> eponymous Tiryns is commemorated as Lord Laertes, who
> planted an olive tree, around the trunk of which Odysseus
> and Penelope built their immovable bed, symbol of the
> eternal Greek civilization.
>
>
> Next time: field E 12
>
> Regards Franz Gnaedinger
>
>
>
> > Field 9 on the Elaia side of the Phaistos Disk, Evans 25 23 34 27,
> > Ohlenroth Y L AE N (ypsilon lambda aetha ny), yields YLAEN
> >
> > http://www.seshat.ch/home/tiryns.GIF
> >
> > Evans 25, Ohlenroth Y (ypsilon), shows a ship and refers to
> > hydor (beginning with an aspirated ypsilon) = water, in the plural
> > waters, element of a ship. A ship or a boat belonged to the Cretan
> > Elaia, as shown on the gold ring from Mokhlos:
> >
> > http://www.seshat.ch/home/elaia.GIF
> >
> > Evans 23, Ohlenroth L (lambda), shows a column and refers to
> > lithos = stone, suiting the grotto of Elaiaon Oros near Phigalia,
> > wherein a wooden statue of Black Demeter Melaina was worshipped.
> >
> > Evans 34, Ohlenroth AE (aetha), shows a fly and refers to ainis
> > = one year old, as flies don't get older.
> >
> > Evans 27, Ohlenroth N (ny) shows a hide and refers to nakae =
> > fleece. On a gold disk it would be a golden fleece representing
> > a gold ingot. However, in a later field on the Elaia side, the
> > hide is followed by the pictogram that shows a part of the chest,
> > an arm and the knive of the priest who carries out the sacrifice.
> > You can't slaughter a gold ingot, so the hide must represent
> > a sacrificial animal. Field E 2, YLAEI, shows the same signs,
> > only the last one is different, the head of a pig. To Demeter
> > had been sacrificed pigs and oxen, so the hide in field E 9 may
> > represent an ox. Now I have to ask for your special attention.
> > The sign could represent both a gold ingot in the shape of
> > a fleece _and_ an ox: if the gold ingot is the equivalent of
> > a cow, a bull, or an ox; the price one has to pay for such
> > an animal. The gold ingot may then have the size of about
> > a human hand and weigh some 100 to 200 grams. Would be a nice
> > surprise if someone would find a stone mould for casting such
> > gold ingots in the debris of downtown Tiryns, which, I said
> > it many times before, has not yet been excavated.
> >
> > An even bigger surprise would be a pair of gold disks.
> >
> > I wonder if this works. Pour hot beeswax on a side of the Phaistos
> > Disk. Let it cool. Remove the wax disk from the clay disk. Do the
> > same with the other side. Embed both wax disks in a plaster mould,
> > leaving canals. Pour melted gold into the plaster mould. Let it
> > cool out. Break up the plaster mould and work upon the gold disks.
> > The signs will be elevated, and the spirals will turn the other
> > way round. Have a look at the gold signet ring from Tiryns. The
> > four lion-wolf-dog-bee men in front of Demeter represent, I
> > believe, eponymous Tiryns and his successors. There are tiny
> > spirals on their shoulders (diameter on the ring less than
> > two millimeters!), which turn the way the spirals would on gold
> > disks fabricated in the above way:
> >
> > http://www.seshat.ch/home/ring.gif
> > http://www.seshat.ch/home/ring2.JPG
> > http://www.seshat.ch/home/ring3.JPG
> > http://www.seshat.ch/home/ring4.JPG
> >
> >
> > Next time: field E 11 (field E 10 having already been bespoken)
> >
> > Regards Franz Gnaedinger
> >
> >
> > > Field 8 on the Elaia side of the Phaistos Disk, Evans 35 18 7,
> > > Ohlenroth AI S E (alpha-iota sigma epsilon), yields AISE of
> > > EAISE
> > >
> > > http://www.seshat.ch/home/tiryns.GIF
> > >
> > > Evans 35, Ohlenroth AI (alpha-iota), shows a vine twig and
> > > refers to aithiops oinos = sparkling wine, a standing formula
> > > in Homer. Sparkling wine was reserved for guests of honor and
> > > old peaople. Here it is a reference to the vegetation goddess
> > > of Old Europe who survived in Demeter / Elaia.
> > >
> > > Evans 18, Ohlenroth S (sigma), shows an angle and refers to
> > > sanis = board, plank, writing table, scaffold, door ... and
> > > is a hommage to the shrine of the Goddess of Old Europe
> > > and the villages of the early farmers.
> > >
> > > Evans 7, Ohlenroth E (epsilon), shows an oven and refers to
> > > Demeter / Elaia. The oven resembles the one in the shrine
> > > of the Bird Goddess in Sabatinovka, Southern Bug Valley,
> > > Moldavia, Early Cucuteni:
> > >
> > > http://www.seshat.ch/home/kirike11.GIF
> > >
> > > Field E 8 contains three signs, the middle of which is
> > > a symmetric pictogram: an angle. If we consider that sign
> > > as indication of equivalence and symmetry, we may ask what
> > > a vine twig and an oven have in common. Both are references
> > > and hommages to the Goddess of Old Europe who survived in
> > > Demeter. Have another look at the wonderful gold signet ring
> > > from Tiryns:
> > >
> > > http://www.seshat.ch/home/ring.gif
> > >
> > > There are ears of grain on the sky, there is a veritable rain
> > > of grains, there are grains on the robe of Demeter, and the
> > > four kings in front of her raise libations jug presumably
> > > filled with sparkling wine in honor of the Goddess.
> > >
> > >
> > > Next time: a gold ingot in the shape of a fleece as price
> > > of a one-year-old cow or bull, field E 9

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