Re: Famous "Celtic" nations may be misnamed
From: Philip Deitiker (Donevenask_at_worlnet.att.net)
Date: 09/11/04
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Date: Sat, 11 Sep 2004 15:23:16 GMT
david_christainsen@hotmail.com (David Christainsen) says in
news:15910715.0409110631.50ba1175@posting.google.com:
> Dear Friends,
>
> Reuters
> Genetic studies hint at unexpected origins of clans
> http://msnbc.msn.com/id/5955701/
>
> "DUBLIN, Ireland - Celtic nations like Ireland and Scotland
> have more in common with the Portuguese and Spanish than
> with 'Celts' — the name commonly used for a group of people
> from ancient Alpine Europe, scientists say."
>
> Comments?
And so what's new?
However just to be clear, the majority of Irish haplotypes have
probably been in the vicinity since before the end of the last
ice age. I think that is long enough to establish their own
genetic/cultural and ethnic Identity.
Celt is a culture/language, it shows very little genetic
compliment. In addition the HLA evidence tends to indicate that
the iberians and portuguese were restricted south of the
continental origin of the Irish/Cornish group. There is better
evidence for a relationship with the basque, who have both the
west african HLA types (via iberia) and the eastern types (via
black sea region) and show these type in recombinations
suggesting an ancient population structure in the region. There
are three primary derivative populations.
1. The Irish/Cornish/[scottish]/Norse
2. The flemish
3. The Polish and czech clusters.
There is also an apparent sister population in the Etruscans.
There is also a pluasible remnant population in the Marsilles
region of france; however, it has been heavily transformed.
France and Germany are enigmatic. Frances population is
composed of genetic contributions from
Iberia, Basque, Irish, Greece [Italy] and Austria. Germany
differs little from france.
The primary nodes in europe are.
1. Sardinia {isolation and age}
2. Ireland {isolation}
3. Basque {isolation and age}
The most genetically diverse populations are in
1. Iberia (age and recent african contribution)
2. Greece (age and recent african contribution)
The riddles in the genetics are.
1. How many deep nodes exist in spain.
2. Can Frances population structure be effectively divided into
subgroups.
3. Is Italians southern regions more genetically diverse and
longer standing than the northern regions.
4. Are the subnodes in the British population indicating a 4th
member of the basque expansion?
5. What is the connection between belgium and armenians.
6. What is the connection between the czechs and the svanetians.
7. What exact location in europe has the highest frequency of
markers shared with korean, ainu and Japan.
8. Are there remnant pictish elements in Scotland, or are the
picts simply another protoIrish branch.
As I have pointed out, with disagrement amoung the members of
various groups, I beleive that the iberians and sardinians are
the oldest europeans of consequence, despite the lack of
cultural evidence, the micronodes in spain lead me to believe
that the region was settled from africa and very small isolated
pockets that expanded later. One of these expansion products
later merged with an eastern expansion forming the protobasque,
this had to have occurred before the end of the last ice age.
These groups were trapped in various pockets after the end of
the last ice age, and one of these was the protoIrish. When the
ice age ended this group was in a better position to expanded,
and it expanded into the region proximal to ireland and then
northeast ward to scandinavia. There are also pockets that are
evident in other parts of europe and in particular in france and
germany suggesting this group was a major initial colonizer of
post LGM western europe.
-- Philip - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Mol. Anth. Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DNAanthro/ Mol. Evol. Hominids http://home.att.net/~DNAPaleoAnth/ Evol. of Xchrom. http://home.att.net/~DNAPaleoAnth/xlinked.htm Pal. Anth. Group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Paleoanthro/ Sci. Arch. Aux http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sciarchauxilliary/
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