Re: how do modern day egyptians feel about the ancient egyptians?

From: Yog-Sothoth (Allotrios_at_gmail.com)
Date: 09/24/04 

Date: Fri, 24 Sep 2004 11:32:54 +0100

Goat like "Tom McDonald" <tmcdonald2672@nohormelcharter.net> while
grazing in <10l77qunfj9ql2c@corp.supernews.com>, made the following
shapes:
> Jan Pompe wrote:
> > Tom McDonald wrote:
> >
> >> Jan Pompe wrote:
> >>
> >>> Kendall K. Down wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> In message <MPG.1bbc104d73549d098acf0@news.demon.co.uk>
> >>>> Yog-Sothoth <Allotrios@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>> He had sex with a 9 year old. For ***'s sake if this
> >>>>> was not rape then nothing is.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Rape is non-consensual sex. Look it up in the
> >>>> dictionary. There is no evidence that the girl was not
> >>>> consenting.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Even in ancient societies people understood that a 9
> >>> year old is unlikely to be fully cognisent of what she is
> >>> getting into and hence counted it as rape.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> You will, of course, provide the evidence to support your
> >> contention.
> >>
> >
> > It's in Kidushin now go and study.
> >
>
> So your evidence is buried somewhere in Jewish writings about
> holiness? I will note that this is an inadequate response for
> two reasons.
>
> 1. Your contention referred to 'ancient societies'. Plural.
> At best, your reference was to one ancient society.
>
> 2. I asked for your evidence, not for one of your reference
> books (library, more like). There are proper ways to reference
> evidence. They are simple, and easily learned. Learn them, and
> apply them.
>
> Now, what is your specific evidence that '... in ancient
> societies people understood that a 9 year old is unlikely to be
> fully cognisent of what she is getting into and hence counted it
> as rape.'
>
> Do you mean all ancient societies, or only some. If the
> former, you've a job of work cut out for you to prove it. If
> the latter, then you have no case except for those specific
> cultures.

According to Xenophon, all theories about pederasty in Sparta were
bull***. It wouldn't surprise me if it was the case elsewhere too,
since there are never explicit statements of its existence, but
rather vague interpretations of modern historians.

"Last but not least, it is frequent misconception that Spartan
society was also blatantly homosexual. Curiously, no contemporary
source and no archaeological evidence support this widespread
assumption. The best ancient source on Sparta, Xenophon, explicitly
denies the already common rumors about widespread pederasty.
Aristotle noted that the power of women in Sparta was typical of all
militaristic and warlike societies without a strong emphasis on male
homosexuality - thereby likewise confirming that in Sparta this
"positive" moderating factor on the role of women in society was
absent. There is no Spartan/Laconian pottery with explicitly
homosexual motifs - as there is from Athens and Corinth and other
cities. The first recorded heterosexual love-poem was written by a
Spartan poet for Spartan maidens. The very fact that Spartan men
tended to marry young by ancient Greek standards (in their early to
mid-twenties) suggests they had less time for the homosexual love-
affairs that characterized early manhood in the rest of Greece.
Certainly the state considered bachelorhood a disgrace and a citizen
who did not marry and produce future citizens enjoyed less status
than a man who had fathered children. In no other ancient Greek city
were women so well integrated into society. This speaks against a
society in which homosexuality was exceptionally common. "

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