Re: Did the Trojan war really happen the way Homer said it did?

From: Franz Gnaedinger (frgn_at_bluemail.ch)
Date: 12/07/04 

Date: 7 Dec 2004 09:52:25 -0800

Yes, beta makes an utter mess, even of quotes. They dont even
respect a space between two lines. I unquoted my list of symbols
in Homer's Odyssey, now they are given as quotes again, all empty
lines removed, like a dough that did not go up and was baked into
a brick instead of a bread.

Really unhappy about beta. Deja News, later Deja, was very fine,
simple and functional. Then they tried to make it more fancy by
rendering the ASCII messages in proportional fonts. And that was
the begin of the end of Deja. It was sold to Google. The Google
groups interface was very fine, simple and functional. Now they
are trying to make something fancy out of it. May it be they
wish to sell the Usenet archive, as Deja did some years ago?

Really unhappy about beta Franz Gnaedinger www.seshat.ch

> Testing Google beta groups - I fear the new interface makes a mess
> of everything, not only of my number patterns and the layout of
> the ASCII messages but also of the quotes. Here I unquote my list
> of symbols in Homer's Odyssey, wishing to know how such a list
> looks like in proportional fonts. As a quote, my lists in beta are
> a mess. I saw that sci.math is still ASCII. Why don't they keep ASCII
> for all the scientific groups? And sorry if these message should
> appear a couple of times: the posting service of beta doesn't yet
> work properly, several people had the same problem I encountered,
> we had to send our messages several times until it was posted, and
> then they appeared as many times online as we had to try.
>
> Franz Gnaedinger www.seshat.ch
>
>
> Part 2 of my list of symbols in Homer's Odyssey (part 1 below)
>
> * asterisks mark insights gained in this thread
>
> Hermaes, messenger of the gods, can move anywhere in no time,
> nobles each human work, can make everybody fall asleep and wake
> them up again, also the god of the thieves -- alter ego of Homer,
> who considers himself a messenger of the gods; who, in his poems,
> can move from any place to any other place in no time; who can
> fool us or open our eyes as he likes; who makes a swineherd one
> of the most likable figures in the Odyssey; and who, as a bard,
> uses or "steals" verses from other bards
>
> Argos, dog of Odysseus -- evoking the watchful Argivian Alliance
> that was symbolized by a circle of dots around a central dot
> (Evans 12 on the Phaistos Disk, tattoos on the staring plaster
> head from Mycenae)
>
> Argeiphontes, epithet of Hermaes -- actual or virtual member
> of the Argivian Alliance, looking out for enemies
>
> * Beautiful Helen of the white arms, her long glittering robes --
> tin, tin ingots, shiploads of the glittering tin ore cassiterite
>
> * Xanthos Menelaos -- copper, the color xanthos (yellow red brown)
> covering the hues of copper and copper ores
>
> * Lovely Hermione, daughter of Helen and Menelaos, resembling
> golden Aphrodite -- golden bronze, alloy of copper and tin
>
> * A slave woman, mistress of Menelaos -- zinc, as occurring in
> "enslaved" form in the mineral aucichalcite from Andros in the
> Troas, a natural alloy of copper and zinc
>
> * Late come strong Megapenthes, son of the slave woman and of
> Menelaos -- brass, alloy of copper and zinc
>
> * Paris-Alexander -- Alaksandu, son of an Achaean mother, king
> of Wilusa (W)Ilios Ilion, who joined Hattusas and became a vassal
> of Muwattalli II in around 1280 BC
>
> * Judgement of Paris -- Alaksandu might have chosen the wife
> of Zeus, Hera, who brought up Achilles: he could have become an
> ally of the Greeks, thus honoring his Achaean mother and winning
> the protection of powerful Thessaly, home of Achilles. Or he could
> have chosen Athene, who, as personification of history, stood on
> the side of the rising Greek civilization. But he chose Aphrodite
> who promised him Helen. Aphrodite came from the copper island
> Cyprus; Helen symbolized tin; and the love for which Aphrodite
> stays means in the context of metals an alloy, here the one of
> copper and tin yielding golden bronze. Alaksandu joined Hattusas.
> The Achaeans, we may infer, had no longer free access to the Black
> Sea, where they retrieved and purchased the rare and precious tin.
> >From now on they had to pay high duties, in metals, presumably tin,
> for passing the Dardanelles, and this was the begin of a series
> of incidents, which eventually led to the Trojan war.
>
>
>
> Part 1 of my list of symbols in Homer's Odyssey
>
> * asterisks mark insights gained in this thread
>
> Homer, actually Homaeros -- pen name of the main bard of the
> Odyssey, Melegistes of Smyrna, a pun: Hermos Hermaes homoios
> homaereo Homaeros. The town of Smyrna was built on the ancient
> mouth of the river Hermos. Hermaes was Homer's alter ego. Homoios
> = equal, similar, refers to the similarity of the epics Iliad and
> Odyssey. Homaereo = I unite speaks for Homer's wish of uniting
> Greece and keeping together the Greek mainland, the many islands
> and the Ionian colonies.
>
> * Circe, Kirkae -- evoking the Goddess of Old Europe, whose name
> might have been Kirike (www.seshat.ch/home/vinca.htm)
>
> Penelope -- a pun on the Peloponnese
>
> Calypso -- Anatolia in around 1200 BC
>
> * Ino -- writing and poetry, perhaps honoring a historical person
>
> Athene -- personifying history, once on the side of Asia Minor,
> now on the side of the rising Greek civilization
>
> * Arkeisios -- mythological founder of the Greek dwellings in the
> Argolis, builder of the Circular Building on the hill of Tiryns
>
> Lord Laertes, a gardener, son of Arkeisios -- eponymous Tiryns,
> hero of the Phaistos Disk, introduced the edible olive elaia in
> the Argolis
>
> Odysseus, son of Laertes -- Greek military power and seafaring
> skills in around 1200 BC
>
> Telemachus, son of Odysseus -- Greece in the time of the Messenian
> wars
>
> Odysseus's journeys -- dreams that bring Odysseus back to Troy,
> over and over again
>
> Strange places Odysseus comes to -- Troy in disguise, and blended
> with other places and periods of time
>
> Polyphem -- Troy; his one eye the citadel
>
> Pleasant Scherie -- according to Eberhard Zangger an early Troy
>
> Animals such as horses and oxen, sheep and goats -- ships
>
> Trojan horse -- a ship with a bow sprit in the shape of a stallion
>
> The oxen of Helios Hyperion -- a Crimean fleet of freight ships
> loaded with precious metals
>
> Winds -- actual winds, or sea forces of the enemy, or forces of
> the memory and conscience
>
> (end of part 1; part 2 above)

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