Re: Merchandise harbor Greenland - killing a Myth

From: Doug Weller (dweller_at_ramtops.removethisdemon.co.uk)
Date: 03/06/05 

Date: Sun, 06 Mar 2005 08:18:29 +0000

On Sun, 06 Mar 2005 01:47:01 GMT, in sci.archaeology, I.E_Johansson wrote:

>Doug,
>if you can't answer a stright question as if you arrived at the conclusion,
>from Ivar Bardson's own word, that the Greenlanders had a harbour where
>Merchandisers and other used to come in Ivar Bardson's days, but insist of
>avoiding that - maybe for a naysayer hurting experience to have to say that
>one of their myths is wrong, then you are far from the subject line. Please
>answer stright question inside topic. Seaver question of yours outside
>topic. She never killed a myth but leaned to too many.

I was replying to a subthread where Soren was discussing the end of the
Greenland colony. Perhaps your comprehension problems meant you didn't
realise that the topic of that subthread wasn't Bardson. I was trying to
give Soren some useful information, and you jumped in saying it was wrong.
I asked you what was wrong about what Seaver said about the end of the
Greenland colony and you evidently can't cope with my questions.

>Btw Didn't you notice that I killed one of her arguments in an other thread?

No, and I doubt that you did.

>There was a reason you know why there in 1434 was made a copy of Nicholas of
>Thingeyre's 1120's map omitting the western parts of Vinland. A very very
>good reason which you as well as other wouldn't have had problem at least
>starting to realise had you read my answer even if I didn't write VM
>directly into the picture. Only hinted.

I have no intention of discussing this with you. You won't and can't
respond to my comments about Seaver's speculations as to the end of the
Greenland colony. Fine, that just reveals you to be the non-scholar you
are. And/or your problems with English.

Doug

>
>Inger E
>"Doug Weller" <dweller@ramtops.removethisdemon.co.uk> skrev i meddelandet
>news:mfek21t0n0qq17lfpdrrhl3b8c4tlhe0ik@4ax.com...
>> On Sat, 05 Mar 2005 19:15:40 GMT, in sci.archaeology, I.E_Johansson wrote:
>>
>> >Doug,
>> >I as well as Seppo who you also tried numerous time to miscredit have
>given
>> >you several examples.
>>
>> Seppo hasn't read the book either so far as I can recall. Nope, no
>> examples from her current book.
>>
>> There hardly aren't a single page in her book that
>> >hasn't got red-marks the way we teachers do when we find faults in texts
>we
>>
>> That's complete nonsense.
>>
>> >read. Don't try this one again Doug. Back to Discussion of topic -
>>
>> which was the end of the Eastern Greenland settlement -- I asked you why
>> you disagreed with Seaver and you never answered me.
>>
>> >Have you arrived to or haven't you arrived to the conclusion that Ivar
>> >Bardson better than today's scholar had knowledge if there was a
>merchandise
>> >harbor in Greenland area or are you still no the naysayers side claiming
>> >lack of contact and only one ship the Royal Knarr sailing to Greenland
>after
>> >1346? It's your own homework and the result of that or of your reading
>the
>> >thread's headpost regarding the merchandise harbor and the ships that you
>> >have to answer. Not anything else. You aren't Seaver and I am not willing
>to
>> >discuss her circle-proofs and assumptions from mythic Sagas. That's not
>in
>> >the thread. Do you accept that Greenland had a harbor to which
>merchandisers
>> >and other sailed at least up to 1400 or not with the knowledge of Ivar
>> >Bardson's background you now have been given.
>> >Stick to the subject line of the thread and give your own opinion. Don't
>act
>> >like a coward leaning to others no matter who they are.
>>
>> Soren was asking about the end of the Greenland settlement. Yep, not the
>> subject line but subject drift happens. Seaver has some interesting
>> comments on that, but you simply rubbished her whole book. I asked you
>> what you had against several specific points she raised - nothing to do
>> with mythic or otherwise Sagas-- (including her speculation that
>> Greenlanders ending up fishing and preserving cod in North America), and
>> you cut out, without my permission, my text and treated it as though I
>> hadn't written it.
>>
>> It's clear that the reason you cut my text and ignored it is because you
>> have no answers. Don't bother to tell me that you won't let me tell you
>> what to answer, etc etc., that's all bombast.
>>
>> Doug
>> >Inger E
>> >
>> >"Doug Weller" <dweller@ramtops.removethisdemon.co.uk> skrev i meddelandet
>> >news:rrvj21tadjjgaj9srdo2qlspp8mu8bkt2h@4ax.com...
>> >> On Sat, 5 Mar 2005 10:59:02 -0500, in sci.archaeology, Steve Marcus
>wrote:
>> >>
>> >> ><snip Doug's post to which Inger responded by writing:>
>> >> >
>> >> >"I.E_Johansson" <inger_e.johansson@telia.com> wrote in message
>> >> >news:RqiWd.18930$d5.145574@newsb.telia.net...
>> >> >> Doug,
>> >> >> I don't care what you think - I read her book and that's one of the
>> >three
>> >> >> worst I ever seen when it comes to how quotes is taken out of it's
>> >> >> contexts
>> >> >> or even worse misinterpreted, circle-proofs used, assumptions from
>> >Sagas
>> >> >> instead of using concrete contemporary documentation which almost
>> >always
>> >> >> exists, conclusions drawn from assumptions of assumptions or even
>worse
>> >
>> >> >> from
>> >> >> leaning to scholars who haven't done their homework. I did read her
>> >book -
>> >> >> I
>> >> >> wish I hadn't.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Never liked her works but the last two were the final drop down in
>> >usage
>> >> >> of
>> >> >> methods for history as well as circle-proofs and misinterpretation.
>> >Sorry
>> >> >> having to say this, but that's the difference between several of the
>> >> >> scholars you refer to and anyone of us who really knows the
>> >Scandinavian
>> >> >> History from Prime sources and knows the difference in validity of
>> >Sagas
>> >> >> and
>> >> >> Prime sources. No matter that she is fluently as a writer,
>> >> >> her work isn't of same 'calibre' due to the fact that she mixes
>> >pineapples
>> >> >> and peaches as if they were one and the same forming non-valid
>> >assumptions
>> >> >> or in some cases presenting assumptions
>> >> >> which were shown by the Professors and other of the Weibull-family
>long
>> >> >> ago
>> >> >> to be Myths.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> ref. works:
>> >> >> Weibull Lauritz, Kritiska undersökningar i Nordens historia omkring
>år
>> >> >> 1000
>> >> >> Lund: Lybecker 1911
>> >> >> Weibull Lauritz, Historisk-kritisk metod och nordisk
>> >medeltidsforskning,
>> >> >> Lund, 1913
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Weibull, Curt, Historiska problem och utvecklingslinjer, Revid.,
>utökad
>> >> >> uppl.
>> >> >> Stockholm : Aldus/Bonnier, 1962 ; ISSN 0516-5628 ; 59
>> >> >> Weibull Curt, Källkritik och historia : Norden under äldre
>medeltiden /
>> >> >> Stockholm: Aldus/Bonnier 1964 ; ISSN 0516-5628 ; 108
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Inger E
>> >> >
>> >> >So when may we expect you to give specific examples of how Seaver uses
>> >> >quotes taken out of their contexts, or even worse misinterpreted, of
>how
>> >> >Seaver used "circle-proofs", of assumptions from Sagas that Seaver
>used
>> >> >instead of using concrete contemporary documentation which almost
>always
>> >> >exists, used conclusions drawn from assumptions of assumptions or even
>> >worse
>> >> >from leaning to scholars who haven't done their homework.?
>> >> >
>> >> >Give specific examples, or withdraw your fabrications. In other
>words,
>> >put
>> >> >up or shut up.
>> >> >
>> >> She won't because she can't. And note that she didn't actually respond
>to
>> >> my questions about whether or not and why she disagrees with Seaver
>over
>> >> what happened at the end of the Greenland Norse settlement. I wonder
>why?
>> >> :-)
>> >>
>> >> Doug
>> >> --
>> >> Doug Weller -- exorcise the demon to reply
>> >> Doug & Helen's Dogs http://www.dougandhelen.com
>> >> A Director and Moderator of The Hall of Ma'at http://www.hallofmaat.com
>> >> Doug's Archaeology Site: http://www.ramtops.co.uk
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>>
>> --
>> Doug Weller -- exorcise the demon to reply
>> Doug & Helen's Dogs http://www.dougandhelen.com
>> A Director and Moderator of The Hall of Ma'at http://www.hallofmaat.com
>> Doug's Archaeology Site: http://www.ramtops.co.uk
>>
>>
> 

-- 
Doug Weller -- exorcise the demon to reply
Doug & Helen's Dogs http://www.dougandhelen.com
A Director and Moderator of The Hall of Ma'at http://www.hallofmaat.com
Doug's Archaeology Site: http://www.ramtops.co.uk