Re: Celtic Origins
Peter,
I know that English isn't your first language. You are in same situation as
me, but contrary to you I don't have any problems reading all the pages, I
read the text many times before in Gaelic, English and Swedish translations
as well so I am familiar with them,
BUT
before you taken yourself more than an hour to read the text and the urls I
refered you to, neither I nor anyone else will believe you to have tried to
find the reason why 'I date' the events to same period as most other
scholars!
Please return when you have had time to sit down reading them. If you don't
take that time, then you can't pretend to understand my answer at all!!!!
Inger E
"Peter Alaca" <P.Alaca@xxxxxx> skrev i meddelandet
news:43e0b66c$0$24246$dbd4f001@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Inger E.Johansson wrote: 552Ef.43666$d5.199669@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx,
> > "Peter Alaca" skrev
> >> Inger E.Johansson wrote
> >>> "Eric Stevens" skrev
> >>>> "hyperoglyphe" wrote:
> >>>>> "Inger E.Johansson" wrote
> >>>>>> "Peter Alaca" skrev
> >>>>>>> Inger E.Johansson wrote:
> >>>>>>>> "Peter Alaca" skrev
> >>>>>>>>> Inger E.Johansson wrote:
> >>
> >> [...]
> >>>>>>>>>> I guess that if more looked closer at the Irish tales and
> >>>>>>>>>> compared them with known archaeologic findings, for example
> >>>>>>>>>> the dates given for when wagon first were used in Ireland
> >>>>>>>>>> compared with artifacts, more trust would be given to the
> >>>>>>>>>> tales than the majority of scholars do today.
> >>
> >>>>>>>>> Big problem: the Tuatha De Danann is not dated.
> >>
> >>>>>>>> big PROBLEM is that Tuatha De Danann's return IS dated if you
> >>>>>>>> only read at least good transcribed Gaelic texts when your
> >>>>>>>> translated versions don't give dates.
> >>
> >>>>>>> Why is /that/ a problem?
> >>
> >>>>>> I don't have a personal problem with it because I am
> >>>>>> almost 100% sure that it's highly unlikely that the group
> >>>>>> of people origined from anywhere in Scandinavia, but
> >>>>>> I know of at least three respected scholars of
> >>>>>> history/archaeology who in private discussions tries to put
> >>>>>> forward theories re. Celts using archaeology but disregarding
> >>>>>> all that doesn't suit those theories. Among the written
> >>>>>> documentations I have heard put forward is the Tuatha De Danann
> >>>>>> tale.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> I said before and I said it again while it's possible that
> >>>>>> Denmark, Danmark for us Scandinavians, might have had it's name
> >>>>>> from
> >>>>>> groups belonging to Tuatha De Danann, the group definitely
> >>>>>> didn't origin anywhere in Scandinavia. Neither written Ancient
> >>>>>> or Early Medieval sources give any information as far as I know
> >>>>>> that could be said to be valid in that type of argumentation.
> >>>>>> On the other hand it does seem more than likely that it was from
> >>>>>> round the North Sea, including Skagerack and Kattegatt that same,
> >>>>>> to south the English Channel, where a megalith culture came to be
> >>>>>> spread during late Stone Age early Bronze Age, and it's to my
> >>>>>> knowledge never proven where it started.
> >>
> >>>>> My Ingerish is poor. Does the above translate to "Mere mortals in
> >>>>> the Bogs of Eire deified in hallowed Sviddish turf" or
> >>>>> is it "Gods from somewhere near modern Sweden (but not 'in' there)
> >>>>> descend to the mortal realm to drag the Irish bog dwellers out of
> >>>>> the stone age."?
> >>>>>
> >>>> I would say 'neither'.
> >>>
> >>> I tend to agree myself. It's plain English I wrote above.
> >>
> >> Well, it's English, but not very plain :-)
> >>
> >>> To my
> >>> knowledge it's never been proven where the megalith culture from
> >>> European coast are south of England up to Scandinavia's North Sea
> >>> coast of the time started.
> >>
> >> If even that can't be proven, on the basis of what
> >> do you think you can date the Tuatha De Danann
> >> to the Bronze Age?
> >>
> >> btw.
> >> "Megalith-building began in four seperate foci
> >> on the western fringe, where Neolithic and
> >> indigenous (Mesolithic) groups interacted"
> >> (Andrew Sherratt, p168, in Cunliffe "Prehistoric Europe")
> >>
> >> Since the Neolitich evolved to the west an north,
> >> it is likely that the megaliths in Portugal and western
> >> France (Brittany) are earlier then those in Brittain/
> >> Northern Ireland and southern Scandinavia/western
> >> Baltic.
>
> > Peter when was the last time you read Lebor Gabala Erenn?
> > In which edition and which language?
>
> The Lebor Gabala Erenn? I thought we (or rather you)
> were talking about the Tuatha De Danann!
>
> When was the last time you read
> Melis Stoke's "Rijmkroniek"?
>
> > Here is an English translation for those who haven't read the
> > essential parts:
> > http://www.ancienttexts.org/library/celtic/ctexts/lebor4.html
> > http://www.ancienttexts.org/library/celtic/ctexts/leborgabala.html
> >
> > some answers, true or false I don't know for sure but interesting to
> > read, can be found in this url's pages:
> > http://www.boudicca.de/tuath-e.htm
> >
> > more here: http://members.aol.com/guenhumara/mythcycle.html
> >
> > more can be read here:
> > http://www.zianet.com/docdavey/irishmyth.htm
> >
> > if you read those and others you will here that the Tuatha's
> > arriving/return happened at least 2500 years ago. In other words
> > during Bronze Age.
>
> I can throw hundreds of webpages on this subject
> in your face, with the same result.
>
> I asked "on the basis of what do you think you can
> date the Tuatha De Danann to the Bronze Age?
> There is no answer to that question in your reply,
> nor an attempt to help to find the answer.
>
> --
> º°º°º°º < Peter Alaca > º°º°º°º°º°º°º°º°º°º°º°º°º°º°º°º°º°º°
>
>
>
>
.
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