Re: Questions


"Eric Stevens" <eric.stevens@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
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On Mon, 25 Sep 2006 07:24:05 GMT, "Alan Crozier"
<name1.name2@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

"Inger E" <inger_e.johansson@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
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"Eric Stevens" <eric.stevens@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
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On Sun, 24 Sep 2006 11:23:17 GMT, "Inger E"
<inger_e.johansson@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:


"Eric Stevens" <eric.stevens@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
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On Sun, 24 Sep 2006 06:25:14 GMT, "Inger E"
<inger_e.johansson@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:


"Eric Stevens" <eric.stevens@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
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On Sat, 23 Sep 2006 18:17:29 -0500, "Searles O'Dubhain"
<odubhain@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:


"Doug Weller" <dweller@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in
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On Sat, 23 Sep 2006 21:36:38 GMT, in sci.archaeology, Inger
E
wrote:

When was Orkney first 'colonized' or do someone at least
know how
old
the
oldest known remain of a house is?

It's noted that the Faero Island had lots of sheeps running
wild
when
the
first known ships passed by.
How old is the oldest known artifact found on any of the
Faero
Island?


There's a UNESCO World Heritage site there, Heart of
Neolithic
Orkney.
I
thought everyone here might have heard of the houses at
Skara
Brae,
and of
course Maeshowe, about 5000 years old. And of course the
Ring of
Brodgar,
but that isn't as famous.

Doug

Amazing how these sites were there so long ago. Was the
climate
warmer
when they were built?


There was a particularly warm period somewhere about then,
much
warmer
than anything in the last 2000 years, but my hazy memory can't
pin
down the date.

Anyhow in light of present days discussions re. global warming
and
rising
waterlevels, I think it's fair to say that during an intervall
in that
warm
period the Ocean's waterlevels were 15 meter higher than
today.....

Oooh ... I don't know about that.

Can you give a citation?

In Swedish? Remember that when my father started to work as one of
the
first
in the global environmental problematic field, almost all important
works
and studies were written in Swedish. That continued to be the case
long
after I myself as one of four introduced Humanecology in early
70's.....
Then there are of course one or two discussing the waterlevel
problematic
higher and lower during periods at the same time as land in north,
from
Scandinavia to Kamtjaka and from Alaska to Newfoundland rised, the
waterlevel lines can't be said to be as easy to follow. The last
time we
had
a rise in the Ocean's waterlevel started around 600 AD and
continued up
to
mid 1300's. Today's so called critical Ice melting in the Arctic
hasn't
reached 1/3 (only 1/6) of the melted Ice -> ocean water as it was
around
1100 AD......
I will return with more info but it takes some time.

All I need is a citation, not a quotation.

I am sure there are people here who can read Swedish and confirm the
accuracy of your source.

In fact, I suspect you may be recalling the substance of work the
conclusions of which have since been superceded.

No I am not. What I used when I had that part up in the pre-stage of
my
C-essay re. the Waterways in Ancient Age towards Lake Roxen, were
official
'very dry written' documentation from larger studies.
That's why I can't use the direct quotes. Lists of figures is one
thing, the
possibility for others to get hold of those during study official
written
but edited to a minor group of scholar within the system, is an other.
One
of the works I had at hand only exists in few copies outside those who
had a
need to have them for their work.
Now the other Swedish edited works I mentioned are written using same
'material'/sources. None of them are efficient to prove anything. The
proof
lies in the former.
I think there is a Norwegian work that might be handy for quotes.
Haven't
read it since mid 1990's but my notes seem to indicate that it is.

Inger, you can correct me if I'm wrong here. I took a quick look through
your C-essay to find references to changing water levels. The only
reference to a 'dry written' document that I can find comes under the
heading "The geological history and land-rise curve of the area", note
33, referring to Lars Håkansson and Thorsten Ahl, SNV PM740 NLU Rapport
88, Uppsala 1976. Somehow the actual title of the report was omitted,
but it's _Vättern: Recenta sediment och sedimentkemi_ ("Lake Vättern:
Recent sedimentary deposits and sediment chemistry").

I don't know if Eric can get hold of that. Nor do I know whether it says
anything of relevance to the Orkneys.

It wasn't the Orkneys which I particularly questioned. It was Inger's
statement:

"I think it's fair to say that during an intervall in that warm
period the Ocean's waterlevels were 15 meter higher than
today....."

I might accept a few centimetres at some time but 15 meters is more
tha I know about.


You can find details at the Royal
Library catalogue. Type sediment into the title field, Ahl into the
author field and 1974 as the publication year.

A second-hand copy is available here:
http://www.hjortedsantikvariat.se/booklists/vastergotland2.htm

Come now! Do you have the appropriate PGP key for an antipodean
speaker of english?

Eric,
Do you read French? Found one work that might help you dealing with the
fluctation in water-levels during Bronze Age. Please observe that it wasn't
only flooding but regress, water has a tendency in the water-cycle to 'go
up' in the air, fall down as rain and snow and in newly dried earlier under
water areas take the closest way down to the ground-watersystem. What had
happened in the earlier period was that the ground-water system all over the
world had decreased and reached it's lowest known value every. I saw a
figure earlier today that in southern China the groundwater had been more
than 50 meters lower in areas where no Ice-Core from Ice Age ever existed.

This is complicated to explain but after first flooding, and than up to 108
meters above todays waterlevel in many areas close to where the Ice Core had
had it's southern 'border', then the water withdraw due to the fact that
water want to have a balance in the water-cycle. After that came a sudden
rise of approx 15 meters above todays level due to the fact that so much
landmass started to rise and that the landrise is a retarding process which
starts not exactly directly after the Ice above melted but close to
depending on grounds. This massive landrise all over northern hemisphere had
an impact -> waterlevels in the Oceans started at one point during the
process to rise once again.

Now come the big problem which no one here put on the table: there were a
"sudden" 6 meter rise of Ocean's waterlevels AFTER migration Age/Western
Roman Empire's fall to the early days of the Viking Age. There you had a
period once again with higher levels than today.... it decreased from mid
1300's to late 1500's.

Inger E

Eric could also contact one of the authors:
http://www.geo.uu.se/luva/personal.aspx?namn=lars.h%C3%A5kanson

Alan







Eric Stevens


.

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