Re: Newbie Astronomy Misadventures (with Questions)

From: Steve Maddison (steve_at_cosam.org)
Date: 01/17/05 

Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2005 01:46:52 +0100

Hi Michael,

I really enjoyed reading your post, probably because a lot of it sounds
so familiar! Seems to me like you're getting on very well. I just hope
you're having as much fun as I did when I was getting the hang of these
things, not so long ago. Comments inline below...

Michael K wrote:
> Ok,after lurking here and one of Yahoo Groups for many weeks learning
> which scopes are toys and which are not and a little about maker's
> reputation, I bought a used Orion Skyview 8" EQ.

Seems like a good choice for a first scope - it will definitely show you
a great deal. I also have the same mount (with a small refractor on it)
and started out with an 8" scope (an LX90).

> It is A LOT more scope than I imagined - my skills certainly do not
> even remotely approach utilizing --let alone taxing -- it's ability
> yet. It is definately more than is physically fun to cart off to a
> dark field. It takes me longer to cart the stuff to the car than it
> does to gear up for overnight century (100 miles) bike rides or pack
> for a week in Vegas (the city, not the star).

I know what you mean about 8" being a lot of scope; I was also quite
taken back by the dimensions of these things when I first saw them. You
could probably get it down to two trips if you treat the mount as tripod
as one unit, the OTA as one unit and put the accessories in some kind of
case(s). It seems to get easier with practise.

> My plan is to work with it at least thru the summer. But I know it
> is not a good sign to be thinking of selling it when you've had it
> less than a week, and I feel aperature envy may set in if it gets
> traded for a 4, 5 or /maybe/ 6".

I'd definitely give this scope a chance. 8" is a nice aperture and I
think you'd regret trading down. If you get into this hobby, you'll
probably (definitely?) end up with several scopes, each fitting
different requirements, and I'm sure there'll be room for an 8" Newt.

> The (Mis)Adventures:
>
> I practiced setting it up several times at home (inside), to get a
> feel for the steps, balancing, sighting, the order of things,
> location of all the knobs as well as moving it around on the mount to
> get the hang of the EQ mount. Seemed a good idea versus fumbling
> about in the dark.

Always a good plan!

> Two nights ago, the seemingly perpetual cloud cover broke and I took
> it out. I could not see Polaris, so I couldn't polar align it, but
> the latitude adjustment should be close. Initially, not a big deal as
> I mainly wanted to check out the optics.

Yep, wouldn't worry about that too much for visual observation. It just
means you'll need to make the occasional adjustment in declination
instead of tracking with only the RA axis.

> So, I planned to align the finder and scope to Mintaka (in Orion's
> belt). I could either see it in the finder OR the (40mm) EP, never
> both.

You may want to try aligning the finder during the day using a
(reasonably distant) terrestrial object as reference.

> Ok, still not the end of the world but dead reckoning/point and view
> just didnt work (the -13F temp being a contributing factor).

Not sure what method you're using, but sightling along the side of the
tube is usually a pretty good way of roughly pointing the scope. If
there are protrusions you can use like gun sights (e.g. nut heads, the
bolts or gaps in the rings) you can usually get well within the FOV of
the finder.

> I did stumble onto M42 which was /gorgeous/. I checked out several
> EPs, focus out - focus in, and everything seems decent (definately
> exceeding my skill level at any rate). I couldn't find M42 in the
> finder scope, so alignment remained FUBAR.

Yup, M42 will always be one of my favourites...

> Neither could I find Saturn amidst the stars in Gemini via dead
> reckoning, so my plan is to try to get them at least aimed at the
> same quadrant of the galaxy using a daytime terrestial target.

I'm not sure a terrestrial reference is the answer - they don't move
like the sky appears to. Saturn is nice and bright at the moment - in
fact it doesn't get much brighter than it is now. If you can see Castor
and Pollox, Saturn is below them as it rises, like this (looking East,
Northern hemisphere):

  o Castor

   o Pollux

        o Saturn

Once you know the pattern, you'll be able to pick it out much more
easily the next time.

> Being in ill humor and quite cold at this point, I decided to take a
> quick whack at the comet, then pack it in. It should have been high
> in the west, but when pointing the EQ mount westward, the eyepiece
> was at 4 o'clock pointing towards the ground. I tried several ways
> of 'getting there' (and must have looked like quite the doofus
> swinging that big tube back and forth and around, back and forth and
> around). In all cases, using the EP would have required some degree
> of crouching except at objects nearing directly overhead. The other
> cardinal points left it at 10, 11, 1 or 2 o'clock - on the upper half
> of the tube - West does not.
>
> I finally picked up the tripod and turned it around (quit laughing),
> but then couldnt refind the Pleiades in it as a starting point for
> hopping to the Comet (ok, laugh if you want).

As you've experienced, a GEM isn't always the easiest of mounts to get
on with. I've so far managed to resist the urge to turn the whole thing
around, but it does often seem much simpler! You may want to turn the
tube in the rings if it gets particularly difficult to reach the EP.
Given that you're not accurately aligned with anything, it can't really
do any harm. Some scopes are actually fitted with rotating rings
specifically for this purpose.

> The next night (last night), was a tad warmer and generally clear.
> The project du jour was simply to align the finder with the tube and
> maybe play with the setting circles. Doing this from the porch would
> allow warm up periods.
>
> Found a bright star, Mintaka, and eventually got them aligned. I
> then calibrated the setting circles to see if I could find M42 again
> using them. No luck, but I did find it using dead reckoning (panning
> the sky tilting the tube hither and thither). I am getting better at
> that, sad to say.

Unfortunately, the SVP's setting circles (and small setting circles in
general) aren't really all that useful for finding objects. You'd
probably be better off star hopping to your target from a known bright
star with the aid of a chart. BTW, M42 is around the middle "star" in
Orion's sword, and easily sighted with the naked eye along the tube.

> --snip--
>
> The 10mm was a bit too much, I couldnt even see light thru the 6mm
> (166x) but the 25mm, 17mm and 15mm seemed pretty good. Jupiter was
> /very, very/ bright, like a piece of full moon, preventing any detail
> at all from the glare. Only the presence of the moons convinced me
> it was Jupe.

It was probably too low in the sky for you to see it clearly. At that
altitude, you're looking through a *lot* more air than if you were
looking straight up into space. I think you'd get a better view when
it's risen somewhat higher.

Another thing to check is collimation - if there's nothing in the manual
about it, look it up on the web. It's very important for getting the
best out of your scope.

> --snip--
>
> Tonight's epic task will be to find Saturn as it rises and there are
> about 4 Messier objects not far from Betelguese to try and find (the
> proper way, not dead reckoning).

You'll want to wait for Saturn to rise a good few degrees above the
horizon before viewing it.

> --snip--

Apart from that covered above, I'm not sure I have any particular
answers to your other questions. I'm sure others will chip in there. All
in all, it sounds like you'll be racking up objects like nobody's
business in no time! Don't forget to have fun in the process ;-)

Clear skies,

  Steve 

-- 
Steve Maddison
Den Haag, The Netherlands
http://www.cosam.org/

Relevant Pages

  • Re: Refractor Telescope problem
    ... Do you have a clear view through just the tube? ... Among all the other suggestions -- it may be that the finder scope is not ... e.g. the red light on the top of a TV transmitting ...
    (sci.astro.amateur)
  • Re: Newbie help!
    ... Make sure that your finder scope is correctly aligned with the main tube. ... At your higher magnification, it should therefore be close to ...
    (uk.sci.astronomy)
  • Split tube dobs
    ... My friend has a 12.5" F8 Optical Craftsman scope his dad bought in 1967. ... He'd like to dob mount it, ... size/weight of the tube will make it extremely difficult to setup by ...
    (sci.astro.amateur)
  • short-tube 6" reflector telescope recommendations?
    ... but the F8 tube and pier mount was way to cumbersome. ... My last scope was a Celestron c102HD on a CG4 mount, ... I'm sure there are other small newts ...
    (sci.astro.amateur)
  • Equatorial Mount
    ... to a larger scope ... obviously comes the choice of a mount. ... So I'm leaning toward another equatorial mount, ... telescope it is no problem but with a much larger tube I see this ...
    (sci.astro.amateur)
Loading