Re: Nicolaus Copernicus


tony_flanders@xxxxxxxxx wrote:
Bits wrote:

While others only speculated, Copernicus proved through titanic
calculations that the heliocentric hypothesis was the simplest and most
convincing explanation of the observed revolution of the heavenly
bodies.

If I may offer some constructive criticism, this statement is
definitely
not true. Yes, Copernicus used titanic calculations. But his
heliocentric
system was, in fact, considerably *more* complicated than the Ptolemy's
geocentric model.

Tony

Copernicus,Kepler and Galileo recognised that the same observation *
infered that the Earth has an orbital motion and this motion simplifies
everything.It is a damaging myth that Copernican reasoning is
complicated and especially when the original authors explicitly state
how easy it is,made even easier with modern time lapse footage of the
Earth overtaking the slower moving outer planets.


* http://antwrp.gsfc.nasa.gov/apod/image/0112/JuSa2000_tezel.gif

"Copernicus, by attributing a single annual motion to the earth,
entirely rids the planets of these extremely intricate coils [spiris],
leading the individual planets into their respective orbits
[orbitas],quite bare and very nearly circular. In the period of time
shown in the diagram, Mars traverses one and the same orbit as many
times as the 'garlands' [corollas] you see looped towards the
centre, with one extra, making nine times, while at the same time the
Earth repeats its circle sixteen times " KEPLER


Astronomia Nova 1609


"Now what is said here of Jupiter is to be understood of Saturn and
Mars also. In Saturn these retrogressions are somewhat more frequent
than in Jupiter, because its motion is slower than Jupiter's, so that
the Earth overtakes it in a shorter time. In Mars they are rarer, its
motion being faster than that of Jupiter, so that the Earth spends more
time in catching up with it. Next, as to Venus and Mercury, whose
circles are included within that of the Earth, stoppings and retrograde
motions appear in them also, due not to any motion that really exists
in them, but to the annual motion of the Earth. This is acutely
demonstrated by Copernicus . . .



You see, gentlemen, with what ease and simplicity the annual motion --
if made by the Earth -- lends itself to supplying reasons for the
apparent anomalies which are observed in the movements of the five
planets. . . . It removes them all and reduces these movements to
equable and regular motions; and it was Nicholas Copernicus who first
clarified for us the reasons for this marvelous effect." GALILEO

1632, Dialogue Concerning the Two Chief World Systems


We find, then, in this arrangement the marvelous symmetry of the
universe, and a sure linking together in harmony of the motion and size
of the spheres, such as could be perceived in no other way. For here
one may understand, by attentive observation, why Jupiter appears to
have a larger progression and retrogression than Saturn, and smaller
than Mars, and again why Venus has larger ones than Mercury; why such a
doubling back appears more frequently in Saturn than in Jupiter, and
still more rarely in Mars and Venus than in Mercury; . . . . All these
phenomena proceed from the same cause, which lies in the motion of the
Earth. COPERNICUS


De revolutionibus, 1543








As for whether it was more convincing, that's a
matter
of opinion. Suffice to say that most people weren't convinced until
Galileo's
telescopic observations and Kepler's genuinely simple model made the
geocentric system seem implausible. And of course, Newton put the
nail in the coffin by proving that Kepler's laws were necessary outcome
of a few even simpler and more universal principles.


All you are doing here is attaching Newton's name to Copernicus,Kepler
and Galileo when it is unwarranted,technically,conceptually and bottom
line.I am well aware that their are outwardly polished careers built on
the Newtonian mutations of Copernican heliocentricity but the actual
amount of people involved in maintaining obvious myths surrounding
Newton on one side and the heliocentrists on the other is surprisingly
small.

If a person cannot gauge that our heliocentric motion and that of the
other planets is seen directly from the moving Earth then they cannot
rightly call themselves astronomers.




Ironically, the primary impetus behind Copernicus's work was the desire
to prove that the universe was ruled by uniform circular motion. And
the
key to Kepler's revolutionary simplification was abandoning both the
circular shape and uniform velocity. So in an odd way, Kepler was
actually closer to Ptolemy than to Copernicus.

- Tony Flanders

Kepler's reasoning is intricate and nothing like the simplistic mess
that Newton created.Familiarity with the original Copernican insight is
crucial to move on to the Keplerian refinement .I would love to work
with people who are genuinely interested in untangling the Newtonian
mutation from the original Copernican and Keplerian blueprints.

Anyone who enjoys seeing the Earth overtake the slower moving outer
planets can then move on to Kepler's specific treatment of the motion
of Mars seen on page 86 of the following work -

http://mitpress.mit.edu/journals/pdf/POSC_13_1_74_0.pdf

It takes a while to become familiar with the plotted motions of Mars
against the background stars,the partial geocentric and partial
heliocentric comparisons .It is an incredibly satisfying experience and
unfortunately buried under 3 centuries of empirical nonsense and myth.

I suppose the great Christian saying of 'seeing through a glass darkly'
applies to those who first encounter Copernican heliocentricity for the
first time.There are no 'titanic calculations',there is just good
judgement in the right places and the sprawling outlines of the great
heliocentric system emerges,slowly at first but then dazzles in its
magnificense and especially by going outside and enjoying the spectacle
from a moving Earth.

.

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