Re: Starmapping software


OG wrote:
"oriel36" <geraldkelleher@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:1159820379.702869.229350@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

OG wrote:

"oriel36" <geraldkelleher@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:1159809785.851218.96500@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx


Let me show you what you believe through Flamsteed's justification of
the return of a star to a meridian -

http://www.nmm.ac.uk/server/show/nav.00500300l005001000

In your mind a shadow returns to noon in 24 hours exactly

What does 'a shadow returning to noon' mean? . Noon is a time, A shadow
is a
moving line on the ground. You have confused yourself once again.


You haven't answered the question.What does 'a shadow returns to noon in 24
hours exactly' mean?



In your mind a shadow returns to noon in 24 hours exactly

Does the NMM definition of the 24 hour solar day include the word
'exactly'
in reference to the passage of the sun across the sky? No, I didn't think
so
either.

In your mind a shadow returns to noon in 24 hours exactly in order to
justify the reurn of a star in 23 hours 56 minutes 04 seconds.

The sidereal day is exact. There is no need to posit an exactness to the
solar day to determine the exactness of the sidereal day.

I can no longer compete with such rubbish as the NMM explanation above
when the actual principles which correlate clocks with axial rotation
through the noon Equation of Time correction at precisely 4 minutes for
each degree of rotation are so gorgeous that I have trouble imagining
why anyone would intentionally destroy it

It does not 'destroy' it to point out that it is dependent on a fudge
factor, a correction. You know what a "correction" is? it is something
needed to make something else correct!

<snippage>

The two step process which correlates axial rotation with the clocks
in 24 hours/360 degrees precisely is now open for anyone who cares to
explain it as a shared astronomical heritage which is gorgeous and
pragmatic.

Yes (apart from not being exact) it is indeed gorgeous; but it is
emphatically not exclusive of other more exact and useful means of
expressing the relationship between heavens and earth.

The correlation between axial rotation and the clock value is and
always will be 4 minutes for each degree of rotation precisely making
24 hours/360 degrees in total.

Where does the clock rate come from? You can't get a precise clock rate
from the Sun can you? The best you can get is a variable clock that needs
correction through the Equation of Time.


The standard pace of the hand movement of a clock was originally
devised by astronomers based on the daily cycle as the Sun returns to
noon .The heliocentric astronomers knew from observence that no two
daily cycles are the same so they equalised the variations by observing
naturl noon and applying corrections of minutes and seconds to create
the 24 hour day and more importantly to facilitate the seamless
transition from one 24 hour day to the next 24 hour day.

It is how the Equation of Time principles which govern the creation of
the 24 hour day get transfered to the heliocentric adaption for axial
rotation which is breathtaking in its genius and its intricacies.Having
delivered the insight by which the orbital motion of the Earth
resolved the observed motions of the planets, by dividing the Earth's
motions into seperate axial and orbital entities,these great
astronomers could then adapt the Equation of Time principles to axial
rotation in isolation.

No external reference is required to correlate the pace of a clock with
constant axial rotation at 4 minutes for each degree of rotation
making 24 hours through 360 degrees.As the Equation of Time,after it is
applied,simultaneously creates the 24 hour day and allows that 24 hour
day to elapse into the next 24 hour day,the heliocentric adaption to
axial rotation was to retain the antecedent equalised 24 hour cycle
using natural noon and superimpose the principle that the Earth has a
seperate and constant axial rotation.In short,the axial rotation of the
Earth was grafted into an existing system which was created by men to
reduce the natural inequalities in a day to a standard 24 hour day and
from there to the creation of the calendar system.

The way everything meshes together makes the old astronomical
timekeeping system one of the most gorgeous human inventions known and
this is even before the heliocentric adaption to axial rotation.It is
the reason why I celebrate it as a shared astronomical heritage .

There is no burden attached to
appreciating the two step process which refers the pre-Copernican
Eqiuation of Time principles to its pragmatic heliocentric adaption to
axial rotation,it simply is for people who have genuine intellectual
and intuitive intelligence and I am prepared to leave it at that.

By two stage you mean 'the approximation of 24 hours isn't precise (though
it may be pragmatic), so it can be corrected by means of a calendrical fix.

Again,I am prepared to leave it for people with both intellectual and
intuitive intelligence to work it out for themselves but I may have to
accept that this forum may not be the suitable place,even if I say that
with a little sorrow.Astronomy is a gift that has to be developed by
exercising the intuitive intelligence which affirms,rejects and creates
things based on physical considerations and the timekeeping systems are
highly intuitive structures.

That being said,the basics are easy enough to understand and should be
within the capabilities of even the most indifferent
astrophotographer.The 24 hour/360 degree correlation is absolutely a
vital point of departure for the understanding of our existence in
terms of geology and climatology while the false 23 hours 56 minutes 04
sec value is nothing more than a cartoon fit only for people who
believe in time travel and football shaped universes.

So,without the correct astronomical point of departure for the Earth's
axial rotation or what amounts to the same thing,retaining the
dominant justification for the Earth's motions using the return of a
star to a location,nobody can do anything productive.The 3 minute 56
second difference between the correct and erroneous values and the
principles which are attached to them represent an error so great that
until it is openly corrected,astronomy will remain dead,and the related
disciplines of climatology and geology will become sterile and barren
as a result of no linkage with the accurate relationship between axial
and orbital motions or these motions as seperate to each other.

It is most certainly an appeal on behalf of a shared astronomical
heritage and the works of the great astronomers including the Western
contribution but not in such a way that it comes from a position of
weakness.It is more of an invitation to develop the astronomical gift
based on intuitive intelligence in an era when most have the intuitive
intelligence beaten out of them through the 'scientific method'.

Humanity is great is the underlying message,a sparlking existence that
suits my Christian heritage,perhaps not the one which you know
exclusively through denominational Christianity but in the great sweep
of creative energy which passes from Christ and the tenets based on
love and not knowledge.You do what is most convenient for you and your
magnification exetrcises but astronomy proper has that majestic
sweeping cycles whaich making existence possible.I can say that I took
notice of those cycles and the people who originally presented them
with the same intuitive intelligence and admiration which is the
priviledge of all genuine and loving people.

That is astronomy !.

.

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