Re: Pioneer Anomoly

On Wed, 22 Jun 2005 23:38:02 +0100, Jonathan Silverlight
<jsilverlight@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

>In message <24ejb1hp7qigjj6n9uall317i7gc8amngi@xxxxxxx>, John C. Polasek
><jpolasek@xxxxxxxxxx> writes
>
>>More correctly, it's that both craft seem to lose velocity in time
>>along their velocity line, regardless of direction. Your version
>>implies that the sun has something to do with it which is not a
>>"given".

I should have said line of sight; Doppler normal to LOS is zero is it
not?

>"Velocity line"? Why not say speed if it's "regardless of direction"?
>Velocity doesn't just have more syllables, it has the added meaning of
>direction. It's a vector. And the sun has everything to do with it - the
>Pioneers are being decelerated by the Sun's gravity and by something
>else.

I think it's that "something else" that is very likely not affiliated
with the sun.

>The measured deceleration is toward the Sun - strictly, line of
>sight to the Earth but the two cannot be distinguished. Motion at right
>angles to line of sight is apparently not as well known, which may
>provide food for thought.
>
>>
>>As to the planet neutrality, I am harboring the idea that the
>>satellite is a "Nova" launched by man from Earth and thus might act
>>differently from the solar system which was initially launched at
>>creation 11 Byrs ago.
>
>More nonsense - and this time it wouldn't even make a Star Trek script.
>BTW, the accepted figure is now 13.7 billion for the universe, 4.5
>billion for the solar system.

Yes I'm aware of that but I used Pioneer's Ap to get 10.7byrs in
analyzing Pioneer 10.
If as is possible,
Ap = H*c = 8.74e-10 mss
then H = 2.9e-18/second,
and if T = 1/H,
then T = 10.87e9 yrs
Just what is the basis for 13.7 byr?

>>Bear in mind, we are not sending 2-way signals
>>to the moon or mars and studying their possible Doppler drifts, and
>>that is all we have to study withr the Pioneer.
>
>Actually we are. If you read Anderson et al. "Study of the anomalous
>acceleration of Pioneer 10 and 11" you will find that Viking data exists
>and rules out a "Pioneer effect" for Mars.

I have half read the paper again and I saw the statement that when P10
got the signal it amplified it and re scaled it and retransmitted it.
I find that hard to believe, when it seems so much cleaner to trigger
a local oscillator and get a clean primary signal back to earth. I
believe it makes a big difference.
I am continuing to investigate.

John Polasek
http://www.dualspace.net

.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: Pioneer Anomoly
    ... Velocity doesn't just have more syllables, it has the added meaning of direction. ... And the sun has everything to do with it - the Pioneers are being decelerated by the Sun's gravity and by something else. ... to the moon or mars and studying their possible Doppler drifts, and that is all we have to study withr the Pioneer. ...
    (sci.astro)
  • Re: Farmers in orbit
    ... Mondian anomalous velocity is towards an artificially defined origin, ... Hubble shift represents a recession velocity exactly equal to Doppler ... that also may show up as an acceleration toward the origin. ... The clock on pioneer is running fast. ...
    (uk.business.agriculture)
  • Re: Farmers in orbit
    ... Mondian anomalous velocity is towards an artificially defined origin, ... With half the rate of expansion there is enough ordinary matter ... Hubble shift represents a recession velocity exactly equal to Doppler ... that this original argument has implications for the motion of Pioneer. ...
    (uk.business.agriculture)
  • Re: Pioneer 10 test of light speed delay
    ... the angle is about 11 degrees. ... V1 is the earthsite velocity in equatorial coordinates with the sun ... the angle through which the velocity is projected on to the craft site ...
    (sci.optics)
  • Re: Pioneer 10 test of light speed delay
    ... the angle is about 11 degrees. ... V1 is the earthsite velocity in equatorial coordinates with the sun ... the angle through which the velocity is projected on to the craft site ...
    (sci.astro)