Re: Hamilton's Rule: light at the end of a LONG tunnel?
From: Anon. (bob.ohara_at_SOD.OFF.Spammers.helsinki.fi)
Date: 07/13/04
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Date: Tue, 13 Jul 2004 16:09:54 +0000 (UTC)
John Edser wrote:
> Bob O'Hara wrote:
>
<snip>
>>>JE:-
>>>Hamilton requires the number of organism recipients
>>>to be >1 unless a single recipient clone is being supposed
>>>related r = 1.
>>
>
>>BOH:-
>>This is actually not true: Hamilton's rule can still predict altruism if
>>b is large enough.
>
>
> JE:-
> You have disagreed that:
> "Hamilton requires the number of organism recipients
> to be >1 unless a single recipient clone is being supposed
> related r = 1." Thus you argue that just one recipient
> can provide an inclusive fitness > 1! Please explain
> how such a event is possible within Hamilton's
> stated logic?
>
If b is greater than 1, as I stated.
> AGAIN: Hamilton's value b was mostly
> donated to > 1 Darwinian selectees.
Has this ever been stated? If so, where?
<snip>
>>>JE:-
>>>at you have to prove
>>>is independent OR dependent effects. If
>>>they remain independent you have to prove if
>>>they can or cannot be simultaneous. Just assuming
>>>another level "has an effect" proves nothing
>>>at all.
>>
>
>>BOH:-
>>*sigh* You assume it has an effect, you measure the size of the
>>possible effect, and then you decide (using some criterion) whether the
>>measured size is significant. This is elementary scientific reasoning.
>
>
> JE:-
> Yes, you firstly establish that a "measured size is
> significant". Do you agree that such a
> size is only significant when it is a part of a
> _non_ random pattern? After a significant effect has
> been documented you have to produce testable
> theories (or hypothesis that are part of an
> existing testable theory) for the 4 classes
> proposed above.
>
Usually the testable theory will come first - i.e. explaining why such a
pattern might be expected. The estimation of the size of the possible
effect is the actual test of the theory.
<snip>
Bob
-- Bob O'Hara Dept. of Mathematics and Statistics P.O. Box 4 (Yliopistonkatu 5) FIN-00014 University of Helsinki Finland Telephone: +358-9-191 23743 Mobile: +358 50 599 0540 Fax: +358-9-191 22 779 WWW: http://www.RNI.Helsinki.FI/~boh/ Journal of Negative Results - EEB: http://www.jnr-eeb.org
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