Re: Hamilton's rule


"Guy Hoelzer" <hoelzer@xxxxxxx> wrote in message news:dll6au$1qor$1@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

> OK. I think I see your logic on this point now. Let me try another taste
> test, assuming that you agreed with my claim that the position of the R line
> can vary and its mean position is a function of the distribution of 'r'
> values from realized altruistic interactions in the population.

The R line IS a mean. If you wish to call a simple mean 'a function of the
distribution', I guess that is true.

> To tie this
> discussion more closely to HR, I am also going to invoke 'b' and 'c'. I
> think you are saying that if 'b' is marginally larger than 'c', then 'r'
> must only be marginally greater than the average relatedness among
> individuals in the population for kin selection to favor an increase in
> frequency of the altruism allele.

Aaaaaarrrrgh! I think that I AM talking to McGinn.

If 'b' is only marginally larger than 'c', then 'r' must be near 1.0 in
order to favor an increase in the frequency of the allele.

The average relatedness among individuals in the population is close to
zero.

I occurs to me that 'r' has two meanings, and they may be becoming confused
here. On the one hand 'r' is a measure of relatedness between two individuals.
Any two individuals. On the other hand 'r' can also be taken as and average
(over all acts of altruism) of the first kind of 'r', where the two individuals
for each 'r' in the sample are the donor and the recipient.

If you read Hamilton's rule as "If rb>c then the altruism allele will increase
in frequency in the population", then you are obviously using the second kind
of 'r'. But if you take the rule as "If rb>c, then the donor is advancing
his genetic interests", then you are obviously using the first kind of 'r'.
I wouldn't think there should be any confusion between these two meanings,
but you seem to be confused by this. Or, you are convinced that I am
confused, so you are just not understanding what I am saying. Or perhaps
I am confused, but I don't think so.


.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: Hamiltons rule
    ... >> frequency of the altruism allele. ... marginally greater than the average relatedness among individuals in the ... then you are obviously using the first kind of 'r'. ... > I wouldn't think there should be any confusion between these two meanings, ...
    (sci.bio.evolution)
  • Re: Perpetually Perplexed
    ... There seems to be confusion over the point of Hamilton's rule. ... selection tends to decrease the frequency of the altruism allele ... the tipping point at which kin selection would ... > There were other, smaller, logical lapses in Dr. Hoelzer's remarks, ...
    (sci.bio.evolution)