Re: Religion center in the brain


"Kali" <kali@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:MPG.1f6cc8e925cf8b509896b4@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
In <4502c56b$0$24175$9a6e19ea@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>, Wolf K
El_Lobo_Viejo@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx said:
: Kali wrote:
: > In <45022058$0$29445$9a6e19ea@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>, Wolf K
: > El_Lobo_Viejo@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx said:
: > : Kali wrote:
: > : > In <1157752504.963352.179650@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>, Matt
: > : > Menge mspmenge@xxxxxxxxxxx said:
: > : > :
:
: [I think I've ascribed the quotes correctly below.]
:
: [...]
:
: [Sizemore:}
: > : > : > But in the final analysis, correlations between brain loci and
observed
: > : > : > deficits etc. don't explain how neurophysiology mediates
behavioral
: > : > : > function. But it seems that it does to a number of people.
Neuroimaging has,
: > : > : > for many, become a sort of endpoint. I suggest that this is
because their
: > : > : > conceptualization is now, and has always been, a
thinly-disguised animism.
: > : > : > They already talk as if indwelling entities - call them
homunculi - see
: > : > : > copies of the world, make decisions on that basis, and pull
the levers that
: > : > : > make behavior occur. And now they think they know where the
little men are
: > : > : > hiding in the brain.
: > : >
:
: [Kali:]
: > : > This strikes me as woefully out of touch.
:
: [Menge:]
: > : > : Haven't we analyzed the process of visual perception to the
point where
: > : > : even different aspects of it have been localized to certain
regions of
: > : > : the brain, kind of run in a parallel processing fashion?
: > : > :
: > : > : Best Regards,
: > : > :
: > : > : Matt
:
: [Kali:]
: > : > Yes, although the system is less parallel than dynamic. I wonder
: > : > who "they" (these referenced animists) are.
: > : >
: > : > Kali
: > :
: [Wolf K.]
:
: > : You're one, it seems.
: >
:
: It's not an assumption, it's a tentative inference, based on your
: apparent support of the notion that "different aspects of perception are
: localised in certain regions of the brain." This language usually goes
: along with notions of perception happening in the brain, which in turn
: leads to notions of perception being what the brain does. Or even what
: individual neurons do.

End cells and stop cells are rather distinctive from one
another, as are rods and cones, bipolar cells and ganglion
cells, cellular layers in the lateral geniculate nucleus...

And yes, some functional aspects of perception are consistently
correlated to neural activity in certain brain structures. We
know this not just through neuroimaging (subtraction method)
studies or lesioning but also through valid and reliable
reaction time studies; Ann Treisman's work comes readily to
mind.

We do seem to speak different languages.

Visual perception, as a functional process, physically occurs in
the brain. Entirely. Present contradictory evidence and I'll
consider it.

The issue is not empirical, and your arrogant assertion reflects everything
that is, with all do respect, wrong with "cognitive" neuroscience. The issue
is the sensibility of statements like "thinking is in the brain," and this,
of course, entails some position on issues that are beyond the empirical
facts; it entails taking some stance on, as I said, the sensibility of the
assumptions and conceptualization of the subject matter. That is, the
sensibility of explaining, in a reductionistic sense, facts at one level of
analysis in the same terms as appropriate to that level of analysis does not
rest on any facts expressed at the reductionistic level. The simple fact is
this: "thinking," "seeing," "deciding," etc. are higher-level
descriptions/names for behavior - they are what must be explained at the
physiological level. To say that humans thinking is explained by their
brains thinking is absurd, and that absurdity is not mitigated by the fact
that physiology mediates behavioral function.



[...]

Kali
--
There are in fact two things, science and opinion; the former
begets knowledge, the latter ignorance.
Hippocrates (c460-c.377 BCE) Greek physician. Law


.

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