Re: Aggregate debt
From: Johnny Marcos (johnny5_at_yahoo.com)
Date: 06/29/04
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Date: Tue, 29 Jun 2004 08:52:00 GMT
The Trucker <mikcob@verizon.net> wrote in
news:cbo12c010a8@news4.newsguy.com:
> conservative bean counters always seem to overlook is the advance of
> technology and real capital development.
Ok, then with technology and capital development you want me to believe
all the old retirees will be able to eat and have recreation and
healthcare in abundance. Lets use a farm as an example - when 47
farmers can bend over and pick up berries or sweet potatoes and feed
themselves and only have 1 extra person to feed who is not bending over
and picking up the crops everyone eats - it is not such a big
contribution from 47 people to feed 1 extra non worker - when 2 farmers
have to eat from thier labor and feed 1 non worker - none of them may
eat as well - in the first example their may be overabundance - in the
second there may be starvation. As long as the 47 to 1 ratio is
maintained - you can grow the population to as large as the land will
sustain - but at a 2 to 1 ratio that non worker is probably going to
starve to death. But in your world the robots have come into the fields
and do the farming for us - we don't need people out there in the hot
sun picking up crops - why does anyone still do this - the robots will
do it for free and save the people from heat stroke. Consumption and
production on the farm requires more producers than consumers if you
want "wealth" and "abundance" - start increasing consumption and
decreasing production - the non producing people are going to go way
down in standard of living - they might even starve to death. I agree
technology and capital development makes it better for us all - but the
problem seems to be we have far too many producers coming off the system
too quickly and needing that free titty to suck on. But mama pig only
has 2 breasts for 50 piglets. Some of them aren't going to eat. Mama
pig didn't create enough robot pigs in time to meet the demand of her
piglets. Why do I still have to go into a restaurant and pay for food?
The robots will pick it, clean it, prepare it. In America we live in
one of the most resource rich and food rich nations in the world - why
are there homeless and hungry all over this country? To end human
suffering, we have to increase technology faster than the consumers
demands - but I don't see any robots in red lobster - I do see my wait
times behind the old people in line at red lobster getting longer and
longer - population control would have kept mama pigs piglets from
starving if she couldn't build robot pigs fast enough. In the time of
the depression - people starved to death - but we had an industrial
society and lots of machines - what went wrong - did we let our
population grow faster than the machines could pick and distribute food?
You say a depression is not possible because the government will not let
it happen - without population control or serious advances in technology
that I don't foresee - how do you stop the decrease in the standard of
living and wipe out the coming human suffering? I think the gubbment
feels we have to keep our old ratios in force - thereby importing
mexicans (producers) to work for the consumers coming off the field -
cause they know there aren't enough robot pigs to feed all the piglets -
and in my city the old people are eating lobsters that the poor
mexicans are cooking back in the hot kitchen. If the robots would just
come along the mexicans could sit down and eat too right? Where are the
robots?
> for labor and thus there is simply less work to do than there was
The roads and canals and trains have all been built, the cities all
built, maintenance does not require the labor that building does? The
robots will maintain our cities, upgrade our bridges - fix the roads -
why do people still do this - the robots are doing it for us for free.
Why do I see more and more mexican work crews on my city highways
resurfacing the roads? Why don't we all wake up tomorrow - reach into
our fully stocked fridge with all the food we want that the robots
picked for us - then take all the pills we need that the robots designed
for us - heck I want a new 10,000 sq foot mansion with 20 hdtv monitors
and an indoor olympic swimming pool - the robots will build it for me
for free. I will get into my robot built lamborghini and suck all the
gas down I want because the robots are getting me the gas for free.
Energy - heck - the sun makes so much energy - we will never have a
problem - the robots will figure out a way to distribute it to me so
that I will never want for any.
> before. Conservatives keep trying to prevent this because it really
> cuts into the economic rent that they, as owners of land and
> machinery, can suck.
There is enough food in the world to feed all the hungry of the world,
why do people die of starvation everyday all over the world? You say
the gubbment will not allow another depression - I disagree. When 47
farmers pick crops - they can all give such a small share to the 1 non
worker they probably don't mind - but those 2 farmers who have to feed
the 1 non worker - they probably will mind and let that non worker
starve. My father worked a 30 hour work week and had a nice big house
and big car, I work 40 hours and can't afford a car - I have to take the
bus - he got big steaks to eat - I am lucky to afford a veggie sandwich.
What does it matter that there are more retirees
> and less workers if those workers need work LESS than their
> forebearers in order to support themselves AND the retirees in good
> fashion?
Why are there people starving to death all over the world when there is
enough food to feed every person on the planet? Why don't the robots
run out to all the farms and get the food and send it to africa for
free? You are making the error of assuming mama pig made enough robots
in time to feed her 50 piglets - I don't think she has.
The worker of today and the worker of the future need to
> understand that the real capital that creates productivity increases
> was provided by all those dudes that are now on social security.
The robots don't seem to be getting the food to the people - many die of
starvation everyday. Why is my father about to die from the loss of his
kidneys - the robots will build him some new kidneys for free and put
them in.
> Nope. Republicans and conservatives need more population so as to
> increase economic rent flowing into their aristocratic hands. There
> is no more ludicrous absurdity than a "labor shortage". This is on
> par with a shortage of polio.
The last time you went into the fields where the potatos and carrots
were being picked up - it was robots doing the labor right? If I am an
old farmer and I see 47 people are not working anymore in the fields,
but just 2, I may want to go back to work to feed myself - what if the
field can only now support 2 because our leaders let population grow too
fast while the ratio of producers to consumers kept declining?
In your make believe world technology and capital improvement have
replaced the need for elbow grease - but in reality man is not there yet
and isaac asimovs robots are a LONG WAY off - and to let the ratios of
producers to consumers change in harmful ways until we get there is a
big failing of our leaders. I still believe a depression can happen as
has happened before. If adam and eve had never had any kids that one
fruit tree could have fed all the people on the planet.
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