Re: The Great Divide

From: Jim Blair (jeb_at_wisc.edu)
Date: 08/17/04 

Date: Tue, 17 Aug 2004 14:56:54 -0500

<royls@telus.net> wrote in message news:411dc4e0.9199093@news.telus.net...
> On Fri, 13 Aug 2004 12:30:25 -0500, "Jim Blair" <jeb@wisc.edu> wrote:
>
> >"Mark Monson" <m_monson@ztech.com> wrote in message
> >news:iUPSc.206$Ji.97@bignews4.bellsouth.net...
> >>
> >MM:
> >
> >Are there any who claim patents are not a means of rent-seeking?

jeb:
> >
> >Now THAT sounds like you think patents are BAD because they are a form of
> >rent-seeking.
> >
> >So which is it? If DuPont can't patent the results of their research and
> >then sell or lease those patents, why would they do the research in the
> >first place?

Roy:
>
> An invention is a solution to a problem.

Hi,

OK. Well some inventions solve a "problem" that people didn't even know
that they had.

>....Problems won't go away just
> because patents do.

??? Solve one problem and another one appears. That's what they call
"progress": the creation of new problems.

>....People will still have problems they will want to
> solve,

Yes.

>....and there will still be people willing and able to solve them
> -- who even enjoy solving them.

But who also want to be paid to solve them. Think all those chemists would
continue to work at that Du Pont lab if no one paid them?

>....The purpose of patents is not so much
> to stimulate research as to stimulate _publication_.

No. Du Pont would be happy to publish little or none of their patentable
ideas. They "publish" only what the patent requires.

College professors like to publish so they can get tenure.

>...But we already
> know that academic tenure systems at universities do a much better job
> of _that_ than patents do....

Only non-patientable research is published in academic journals.

jeb:
>
> >How much promising research is on hold for lack of funding (stem
> >cells for example)?
>
> In that instance, funding is not the constraint.

I think it is: the lack of federal money limits research on new embryonic
stem cell lines in the US.
(and that probably helps the UW's WARF since they provide 5 of the available
"approved" lines)
>
> >>.....A reduction in demand for present consumption coupled
> >> with a high percentage of saved wages can only mean a drop in interest
> >rates. How
> >> far can interest rates drop? What is the alternative to banked
savings?
> >Cash
> >> saving? Assuming an inflation rate it is possible that people would
bank
> >their
> >> savings at zero percent.
> >
> >Well the Japanese seem to. But Americans seem more inclined to borrow so
> >they can spend more than their current income.
>
> I am old enough to remember the 70s, when Swiss banks accepted
> deposits only at substantial _negative_ interest rates.
>
> >>...What does that do to the Great Divide concept? How much
> >> are you going to have to sock away at zero percent interest before you
can
> >retire on
> >> your savings?
> >
> >If "interest" in the broad sense (including dividends and capital gains)
is
> >zero, they I say people can never be sure of being able to retire unless
> >they become VERY rich.
>
> No. It would be a fairly trivial exercise for an actuary to design a
> zero-interest "whole life" insurance policy that you would contribute
> toward during your working years, and withdraw funds from after
> retiring. Plug in your age, the amount in the account, and the annual
> amount you want to withdraw from it, and the answer pops out.
>
> -- Roy L

But you also need to know how long you are going to live (withdraw). And
that number (on average) keeps increasing.

What's with this "no interest" business? Some sort of religion thing?
Both Christianity and Islam have denounced interest as "evil", but at least
Christianity has outgrown that hangup.

http://www.geocities.com/capitolhill/4834/intrest.txt

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