Re: Hydrogen economy will never exist

From: william mook (william.mook_at_mokindustries.com)
Date: 07/06/04 

Date: 5 Jul 2004 19:48:39 -0700

Since the junction temperature is below 100 C the heat is low-grade.
It is costly to collect, and useful as well in the right environment
as you suggest. We have built a system that we intend to put at the
South Pole. We've been talking to Raytheon Polar Services about it.
The cost of diesel fuel is about $16 per gallon at McMurdo and
capturing the heat to melt snow and take hot baths and so forth pays
huge dividends. Also, the fact that the sun doesn't set for 6 months
at the South Pole is also an advantage.

"daestrom" <daestrom@NO_SPAM_HEREtwcny.rr.com> wrote in message news:<p7XFc.20535$iJ4.4237@twister.nyroc.rr.com>...
> "william mook" <william.mook@mokindustries.com> wrote in message
> news:407c5321.0407040717.36982363@posting.google.com...
> > Don Lancaster <don@tinaja.com> wrote in message
> news:<40E6FC26.71C7FD5C@tinaja.com>...
> >
> > > There is NO WAY IN HELL that you can produce hydrogen from pv for less
> > > than the ultimate cost of a synchronous inverter.
> >
> > Look, silicon costs about $1 per square inch. That's 15.5 cents per
> > square centimeter. Operating at 120x solar intensity and 20%
> > conversion efficiency that's 2 watts electrical per 15.5 cents -less
> > than a dime a watt.
> >
> > Now add in your concentrator cost. Well, 1 square meter of aluminized
> > PET film stabilized by structural EPS (think of a bicycle helmet)
> > costs about $4.00 - that intercepts about 200 watts electrical on a
> > clear day - another 2 cents per watt electrical. Still under a dime.
> >
> > So we have precision optics and PV for less than a dime a watt.
> >
> > Okay, you do have to cool the thing and point it. That gets you up to
> > 30 cents per watt...
> >
>
> Hmmm cooling....
>
> Could this be used as a low-grade source of heat? After all, much of the
> energy used in a home is just this type. Water heating and space heating
> from this cooling system would provide another 'avoided cost' by replacing
> the conventional forms of energy used for such purposes.
>
> One would have to maintain your original cooling sink for those times when
> water/space heating isn't needed, but that is in your original costs. The
> extra cost to circulate some coolant into the home on demand would seem
> relatively small.
>
> If it *does* make sense (thermodynamically and economically) to go forward
> with water/space heating, then a separate question might be if it makes
> sense (again, both thermo and economic) to add some modest thermal energy
> storage.
>
> How much heat does your cooling system currently have to reject when
> operating and at what temperature? (I would make it at about 4 watts per
> watt of electric output) This additional possibility for using this
> rejected heat for another purpose has some interesting possibilities.
>
> daestrom

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