Re: World's First Fuel Cell-Powered Train Locomotive Slated for 2008
From: Ian St. John (istjohn_at_noemail.ca)
Date: 08/12/04
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Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 12:54:39 -0400
Michelle Vadeboncoeur wrote:
> "Ian St. John" <istjohn@noemail.ca> wrote in message
> news:<vnuSc.14785$a65.705843@news20.bellglobal.com>...
>> Ian St. John wrote:
>>> Michelle Vadeboncoeur wrote:
>> <snip>
>>>> I'm guessing that you mean Canadian $. Like in the US, the Prius
>>>> was first introduced in Canada for the 2001 model year. I don't
>>>> think I've heard of any of the original Japanese Prius (1998-2000
>>>> model year) being imported to Canada. My recollection is that
>>>> pricing in Canada has remained similar between the "classic" Prius
>>>> (2001-2003 model years) and the new 2004 Prius. (In the US, MSRP
>>>> for the 2004 Prius at introduction was the same as the 2001 Prius
>>>> at $19995, although the 2004's MSRP just went up $300 in June.)
>>>
>>> So probably I was quoting $US.
>>
>> Oops. Just reviewed my post. You have jogged my memory a bit. I
>> remember now that the $50,000 figure was quoted to be the 'real
>> cost' of the original prius which they were selling at a loss at the
>> time hoping for volume pricing reductions. Getting to a point where
>> they could make money at a 'regular' price was one reason for the
>> light hybrid development.
>
> Toyota stated that on the pre-2004 Prius that they were making a
> profit, as of 2002.
And you believed them?As of 2004, sure. As of 2002, no way.
> How can a company make a profit on a $50,000 car
> if they're only charging $20,000? (US$).
Who said they made a profit on the original design and why would you believe
it. The original design was like building a ferrari. Not enough volume for
assembly line and volume discounts. And the high tech materials and tooling
was just not in the same class as the normal run of cars. They were hoping
to EVENTUALLY break even. They did it by both build up customers, the rise
in oil prices, and converting to a 'light hybrid' design with much more
borrowing from the normal car lines.
>
> Toyota did sink more R&D money into the new 2004 Prius, but they
> expect to break even on it rather soon (since the Prius is currently
> the 3rd best selling Toyota passenger car in the US for 2004 as of the
> end of July).
Must really burn the ass of those Ford Explorer drivers..
>
> some articles:
> April 8, 2004
> http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/toyota-prius/message/72009
> Jan. 5, 2004
>
http://autoshow.edmunds.nytimes.com/news/autoshow/articles/100916/page063.html
> Dec. 8, 2003
> http://www.alternet.org/story.html?StoryID=17333
> Oct. 28, 2003:
>
http://news.ft.com/servlet/ContentServer?pagename=FT.com/StoryFT/-FullStory&c=StoryFT&cid=1066565437828
> http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/2004-prius/message/11370
> Sept. 29, 2002 article:
> http://www.evworld.com/databases/shownews.cfm?pageid=news290902-0-4
> Sept. 24, 2002 article:
> http://www.catiaworld.com/lang1/mem/news/arc/_disc2n/00000061.htm
> http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/toyota-prius/message/40854
> May 30, 2002 article:
>
http://www.planetark.org/dailynewsstory.cfm/newsid/16184/newsDate-/30-May-2002/story.htm
> March 30, 2002 :
> http://www.acpropulsion.com/CARB/A_Brooks_Testimony/sld007.htm
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/toyota-prius/message/30046
> Dec. 30, 2001 article:
> http://www.climateark.org/articles/2001/4th/hycarpit.htm
> Dec. 21, 2001 article:
> http://www.ctnpublishing.com/pubs/ETIC/ETIC_2001/ShowTimesDay1.pdf
>
> most recently:
> Jun. 22, 2004:
> http://pressroom.toyota.com/photo_library/display_release.html?id=20040623
> <quote>
> Is Toyota making money on the Prius?
>
> At Toyota, we believe environmental issues are the most important
> challenges for auto manufacturers. It is our mission to undertake all
> efforts to develop and expand the use of environmentally friendly cars
> and hybrid technology is the key to this effort.
>
> The Prius is profitable and Toyota is further trying to reduce costs
> while continuously improving the quality. We expect this generation
> Prius to be profitable more quickly than the first generation Prius,
> thanks to volume and improving economies of scale.
> </quote>
And after that exercise in the PR mans art I have no idea if they are making
a profit or just expect to make a profit.
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