Re: How many hydrogen cars on the road in the US today?

On May 23, 2:05 pm, Eeyore <rabbitsfriendsandrelati...@xxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
Williamknowsbest wrote:
My goal is to have 20% of America's cars hydrogen by 2012 and 80% by
2017 - I will explain how.

First, instead of fuel cells and electric motors, which are cool

No. Fuel cells run very *HOT* actually (they produce 'steam')

HAHAHA! What dork you are Grahm. You misread what I wrote. Cool
not referring to temperature jerk, cool meaning showing promise -
being efficient - the bees knees - why didn't you know that? You're
either a big dork or just being an ***. Does it matter which?
lol.

and are collosally
expensive

Yes. Which is why focusing only on changing the fuel system to an
existing internal combustion modified to burn hydrogen directly makes
a lot of sense for entering the market. As the engineers of BMW can
attest;

http://www.bmwzentrum.com/exhibits/hydrogen_car.asp

As I said, the critical issues are the cost of hydrogen in the first
place, its distribution and how its stored aboard the vehicle.

BMW likes liquid hydrogen and their models still retain the ability to
burn gasoline.

I prefer highly compressed hydrogen in advanced tanks, and also like
the idea of stilli being able to burn gasoline. So, you don't even
remove the 15 gallon tank, you just put two 2,100 liter compressed
hydrogentanks in the car and create an automated hydrogen filling
system with the fill points under the vehicle.

You drive up to the 'pump' the way you drive up to an automated car
wash or drive through. There's a screen at the driver's window, and a
robot arm under the car beneath the roadway that access the car from
underneath when the trap door opens.

You just pull up into the tiny dimple that your front wheel stops in.
Then you roll your window down and scan your credit card, and wait a
second while your tanks are refilled automatically. MEMs based
devices in each tank measure the fuel received and communicate with
the filling robot - to confirm amounts exactly. So, you don't have to
trust your pump to be accurate, you have your own measuring device in
your tanks..

Its just that simple. Drive up, scan your card, refill and go.

The cost of conversion is $5,000 per vehicle, and any vehicle can be
converted. Additional tanks for larger vehicles cost $2,500 - and the
first few million customers get a 50% off their hydrogen purchases up
to the cost of the installation cost.

btw largely due to their use of rare and pricey materials as catalysts
(which wear out btw and so the fuel cell will need regular and very expensive
replacement).

True. Fuel cells are pricey. Which is why mixing hydrogen with air
and burning it in an internal combustion engine instead of gasoline
makes a lot more sense for early adopters. These other problems will
be worked out eventually, but we should make the conversion to
hydrogen dependent on that.

and will be developed, eearly adopters only need to replace their fuel
system with a hydrogen supply since hydrogen can burn in a way that
easily supports conventional internal combustion engines.

Have you even the tiniest idea how energy wasteful that is.

HAHAHA! You rail against the cost and complexity of fuel cells and
then you totally shift gears and rail about the inefficiency of
burning hydrogen. You are an ***. Do you work for a major oil
company? Grahm, the efficiency of burning hydrogen in your engine is
about the same as burning gasoline. The critical factor is the cost
of the heat. Heat engines are not as good as a fuel cell -
potentially. That's why I said fuel cells will someday replace
internal combustion engines.

But we don't have to wait for that to happen for hydrogen to replace
oil - which is my point. We can replace oil with hydrogen TODAY.
Right now, using my low cost solar panels to make the hydrogen from
water..

Look, a kg of hydrogen costs me $0.17 to make with my solar technology
as I've described and is sold for say $2.17 per kg for use in your
car. I can sell a kg of hydrogen to replace natural gas in your home,
office and business for $1.17. I can sell a kg of hydrogen to
utilities for say $0.27 - to replace coal in their power plants.
Everyone's ahead - even though efficiencies are exactly the same as
they are today, because all we're doing is replacing oil and coal with
hydrogen gas. From a pipeline for stationary users. From a
pressurized tank for mobile users.

The only users that will need liquid hydrogen are airlines. And
they'll pay $2.17 per gallon heat equivalenjt or thereabouts.

A gallon of gas costs me $0.26 to make from US mined coal and my
hydrogen and say I sell that for $2.26 - So, I still make $2 profit
per gallon equivalent heat,

Customers still pay less than $3.00 per equivalent gallon - and they
don't have to change anything or wait for future technologies.

Last time I calculated it you get back (at the wheels) about 6% (one sixteenth) of
the system input energy !

So? Is that even right? It doesn't really matter because you get 120
MJ of heat in your internal combstion engine for a cost of $1.82 by
burning 84 grams of hydrogen or burning 1 gallon of gasoline - WHO
CARES WHAT THE ENERGY EFFICIENCY IS?

The point is, people can convert to hydrogen and avoid carbon
emissions and end our reliance on foreign oil supplies TODAY without
waiting for expensive and difficult to achieve technical fixes to
arcane fuel cell technology.

That technology isn't the critical factor anyway. Its the cost of
solar panels. And that's what I've done - made solar panels very
cheaply.


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