Re: How many hydrogen cars on the road in the US today?

On May 28, 12:58 am, Don Lancaster <d...@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Bill Ward wrote:
On Sun, 27 May 2007 07:55:33 -0700, Williamknowsbest wrote:


Conventional solar power is 5x to 10x more expensive (depending on
location) than conventional power sources. You said yhou'd by it at those
prices not me.

Now, my concentrated photovoltaic system reduces those costs of solar to
1% of conventional solar - that means instead of $0.30 per kWh (at the low
end in the sunniest of regions) - costs fall to $0.003 per kWh !!! At
these prices, it makes sense to cover as much land as you can, and make
hydrogen and use it to hydrogenate coal direclty and sell fuel - since
gasoline can be made for $0.26 per gallon.

I've got two installations going in in Indonesia - they're $6.3 billion
and will be worth $85 billion when completed. Profits from these
operations will allow me to buy an oil marketer in the US and a coal
company, and create tremendous value there - from $200 billion on up.
From that point I will populate some 5 million acres of sunny land I have
options on throughout Nevada, Arizona, New Mexico, California. I will
make hydrogen and use it to restart gas wells and oil wells on these lands
- and sell the gas and oil to cover costs. I will continue to expand and
sell hydrogen to nearby coal fired plants - taking the coal in trade. I
will use that coal with more hydrogen to make gasoline and jet fuel at
$0.26 per gallon - and sell that through my oil remarketer. I will expand
the pipeline to national proporations. I will also run in parallel HVDC
lines and sell DC power to utilities and also use it to make low cost
fresh water, bleach and fertilizers as well as hydrogen.

Other projects in other regions will follow a similar approach - and then
I will connect the major projects - first North to South - Chile to the
US, South Africa to North Africa, Mongolia to Australia - the Kasmir to
the Arabian (not really North South more East West - but an important
route nevertheless) - And then East and West - Across the Pacific - Across
the Atlantic - Across the Indian Ocean - and then branch out from those
major backbones with powered roadways HVDC lines and hydrogen pipelines -
all fed by low cost solar panels in the deserts.

Can you tell us how many kW of your revolutionary new solar panels are
presently in operation? How long have they been in production?


Bill Ward

And how many decades before they reach fully burdened, fully accounted
net energy breakeven?

Many thanks,

Don Lancaster voice phone: (928)428-4073
Synergetics 3860 West First Street Box 809 Thatcher, AZ 85552
rss: email: d...@xxxxxxxxxx

Please visit my GURU's LAIR web site at Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Well I spend nearly an hour responding in detail to Bill Ward's
question and I get the message my post was successful and bam! it
never appears! Don't know why that shit happens to me - but there you

Bill there are seven prototypes, and two of them have changable parts
that let me try out different things so dozens of ideas have been
tried out and solid technical data retrieved.

More below.

To answer Don's question, at $70 per peak kilowatt and with a 20 year
life span, annual payments for capital and maintenance would run
around $6.40 per year. These panels placed in a region of 1,600 hours
of sunlight per year produce about 32 kg of hydrogen each year.
That's $0.20 per kg. - or $0.18 for the equivalent of a gallon of

Now what do you want to do with the hydrogen? If you sell it for the
same price as gasoline - say $3.00 per gallon eqiuvalent - you earn
$96 per year with this technology so payback is 38 weeks.

If you use the hydrogen with low-rank coal (which is also a source of
water when you dewater it - and brown coal has enough iron in it so
you don't need to add catalysts) to take the 32 kg each year and use
it to convert 600 kg of coal into 175 gallons of gasoline each year -
at $3 per gallon that's $525 - but the problem is here is that you've
got $405 worth of coal processing equipment to the $70 worth of solar
panels.which increases your payback by 9 weeks to 47 weeks.

You actually don't get $3 per gallon - so, your payback is more like 2

The advantage of making a commodity like gasoline or jet fuel from
coal is that you can arrange to sell most of the fuel from the
facility at a discount and not give up ownership of the technologyor
fhe facility - and still retain a sizeable income stream from the
facility. A sweet deal for everyone.

Getting back to what I've got working in the field,

I have a 1 kW system that is built around an 8' dish that has a 2-axis
tracker and has been operating over 3 years now.

All my innovations are taught here;

Think of the prototypes as the concept cars - and like Tucker, I went
around the world finding customers for them. Now, orders in hand I'm
off to build my factory to supply the cars to the customers..

(scroll down to read about my Indonesian subsidiary Sugico Mok Energy)

The cool part here is that I'm selling fuel I produce to investors.
They don't own the technology, they don't even own the facility. I
build own and operate the facility and provide the fuel to the
customers - and keep a portion of the fuel myself to cover costs.

So, now I'm in the process of making my factory to build my 'cars' -
in this case, panels - along the lines of my model cars - aka
prototype panels.

Right now I've just acquired an 83,000 square foot building with 9,000
sf of office space. This used to be a warehouse for a medical supply
company and is equipped with 30,000 sf of clean rooms.

I'm installing 100 mm wafer processing equipment to do both front end
and backend processing on $10 wafers - using old equipment from the
1980s acquired relatively cheaply.

In parallel with the wafer process is a molding operation that takes 6
layers of PET - molds them on hot-press rotary molds that are 8 feet
wide - into a continuous ribbon of panels each 8' by 4' in area.. Each
PET layer is 33 microns thick,and altogether they form a shaped set of
water filled cavities that implement a liquid superconcentrator
technology - producing an array of 4,608 lenses on each panel - that
altogether produce 540 watts of electrical power under full

Former lens designs were 1.5 inches thick, but I've since implemented
a folded optical path in each lens that allows a reduction to 3/4 of
an inch panel thickness. Each panel weighs less than 15 pounds and
only 6 square inches of PV material are needed per panel.

Panels when completed form strings that are z-folded in a mechanism
that resembles the machinery used by newspapers to bundle them. haha -
to form blocks that are 8' x 12' x 53' in volume. The larger
thickness panels weighed more and only 1,100 could be put on a string
4,400 feet in length. The thinner lighter panels allow 2,544 panels
to be strung together and handled just as easily - these strings are 2
miles long by 8 feet wide, and generate 1 MW of power under full
illumination. 1,320 strings produce 1.3 GW on a 2 x 2 mile square -
at a cost installed of $93 million.

To maintain costs these panel strings come equipped with two 500 kW
variable load electrolyzers at each end of the string. Each produces
10 kg of hydrogen per hour from 90 kg of water per hour. 1320 strings
with 2640 electrolyzers produce 26.4 metric tons of hydrogen per hour.

In Indonesia 9 squares placed on a spent surface mine at each of the
two sites will produce 237.6 tons of hydrogen per hour. With 4.5
hours of illumination per day, nearly 1000 tons of hydrogen is
produced each day. This hydrogen when combined with 28,000 tons of
coal each day produces 200,000 barrels of gasoline, diesel fuel and
jet fuel - as a blended product - with no bottoms!

The wafer processing equipment operates at 60 wph. That's enough to
produce 120 panels per hour. The plastics processing speed operates
at 2,544 panels per hour - so, the limiting factor in this pilot plant
operation is the wafer processing.

Once we have completed this pilot facility and tested the products in
a variety of ways - and completed a few design spins - which will be
completed in six months - we will acquire 300 mm wafer processing
equipment that will operate at 250 wph - and install it in the 15,000
sf of clean room I'm not using. This will support the plastics
operation speed designed for and allow me to experiment in improving
plastics processing speeds

18 panels per wafer and 250 wph compared to 2 panels per wafer and 60
wph - is an increase from 120 panels per hour to 4,500 panels per

At this rate the 9 squares will take 3 months to produce - at each
coal conversion facility.

The construction of the coal processing and hydrogen equipment which
is purchased from existing suppliers - will take 5 years to install -
so the solar panel side is not the pacing feature of the installation.

We will tweak the plastics production to see if we can up the speed
from 2 mph on the rotary molds - to 25 mph - and once that is
completed, put 9 of the higher speed wafer processing fabs in a new
120,000 sf bilding put out back of the old one - to feed the plastics
processing fab.

We will then build a new panel plant incorporating a silicon foundry
in a 1 million sf facility at a greenfield site north of

In this way we'll move from 568 MW per year to 8.6 GW per year and
ultimately to 118.8 GW per year from this facility. The new facility
will produce 250 GW per year.