Re: National Hydrogen Infrastructure
- From: Williamknowsbest <William.Mook@xxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Fri, 01 Jun 2007 02:31:56 -0000
On May 31, 7:06 pm, Eeyore <rabbitsfriendsandrelati...@xxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
Williamknowsbest wrote:
356,413 tons of hydrogen represent an energy equivalent of 8.3 million
barrels of oil.
So ? That must mean that a barrel of oil has the energy equivalent of 44kg of
hydrgogen. Doesn't sound very convincing to me.
A barrel of oil has 6.1 GJ of energy.
A kg of hydrogen has 142 MJ of energy
A metric ton has 1,000 kg of mass
1000 MJ = 1 GJ
A metric ton hydrogen therefore has 142 GJ of energy
The ratio 142 / 6.1 = 23.28
Multiply 356,413 by 23.28 to get 8,296,827 ~ 8.3 million
Which is what I said.
Barrel of oil equivalent (boe) = approx. 6.1 GJ (5.8 million Btu), equivalent to
1,700 kWh.
I agree with the first number. The second numbrer sounds right since
1 BTU = 1057 Joules. There are 3.6 MJ per kWh - so, 6100 MJ / 3.6 MJ
= 1694.4 ~ 1700
RIGHT SO FAR!
"Petroleum barrel" is a liquid measure equal to 42 U.S. gallons (35
Imperial gallons or 159 liters); about 7.2 barrels oil are equivalent to one
tonne of oil (metric) = 42-45 GJ.
Don't know what all this is for, but I use (because its in my
contracts) 7.33 barrels per metric ton. So, if all you're saying by
this is that 7.33 x 6.1 = 44.7 then I agree
I AGREE WITH THIS CALCULATION
http://bioenergy.ornl.gov/papers/misc/energy_conv.html
Alright.
Hydrogen contains 0.458 MJ/kg.
http://www.probas.umweltbundesamt.de/php/themen.php?&prozessid=%7B56E...
I think you've screwed up here... . WRONG! haha...
A kg of hydrogen contains 142 MJ HEATING VALUE. That's the energy
released when a kg of hydrogen is burned.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heating_value
Its listed here as 141.8 MJ/kg - which is slightly more accurate than
142 MJ/kg I gave - but still accurate when compared to your
outrageously WRONG figure of less than 1/2 MJ/kg - off by a factor of
300 or so. SORRY GRAHAM, YOU'RE WRONG HERE.
So 1 barrel of oil is equivalent to ~ 13000 kg ( 13 tonnes) of hydrogen.
NOPE! NOT IN A MILLION YEARS - YOU'RE OFF BY A FACTOR OF NEARLY 300!
How did you make such a HUGE mistake ?
*****I DIDN'T!*******
hahahahaha..
356,413 tonnes of hydrogen contain 1.63 .10^14 Joules
No, 356,413 tonnes of hydrogen contain a heatiing value (which is what
we're comparing) of 50,539,363.4 GJ ~ 5e+16J and when divided by
6.1 GJ obtains TADA! 8,285,141.5 barrels equivalent ~ 8.3 million
barrels - WHICH I GAVE IN THE BEGINNING
8.3 million barrels of oil contain 5.06 . 10^16 Joules.
Yes, WHICH IS WHAT 356,413 metric tons of hydrogen contain.
You were out by a factor of 310 times !
NO ***YOU*** WERE OUT BY A FACTOR OF 310 TIMES
One third of what America uses each day. Used in
hydrogen powered fuel cells - assuming such can be made at reasonable
costs
They can't.
YOU ARE AS RIGHT ABOUT FUEL CELL COSTS NOT COMING DOWN AS YOU ARE
ABOUT HOW MUCH HEAT YOU GET WHEN YOU BURN A TONNE OF HYDROGEN - NAMELY
- NOT RIGHT AT ALL! HAHAHAHA!
Graham
Yeah, I know who you are dude.
.
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