Re: "Nuclear energy 'not the solution to global warming"

On Sun, 22 Apr 2007 11:45:16 +0200, "Giuseppe" <gpr@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:


"Paul F. Dietz" <dietz@xxxxxxx> ha scritto nel messaggio
news:U4qdnXdlCOzGoLfbnZ2dnUVZ_judnZ2d@xxxxxxxxxx
T. Keating wrote:

Actually, the rock of the oceanic crust has a much lower level of
uranium than
the continental crust. Uranium (and, to some extent, thorium)
preferentially
go into felsic rocks in preference to mafic rocks. The concentration
of uranium in the continental crust is enriched by orders of magnitude
over the average U content of the Earth because of this.


Assumes facts not supported by any evidence. (authoritative links??)

Feel free to look it up yourself; Google would work. The average U
content in the Earth is thought to be roughly that in carbonaceous
chondrite meteorites, which represent the composition of the (condensible)
part of the pre-solar medium. This chart gives those abundances:

http://epsc.wustl.edu/admin/resources/chondritic_abundances.html

Note that uranium occurs at about 8 ppb by mass, nearly three orders
of magnitude lower than the average concentration in the Earth's crust.
This is consistent with the observed geothermal heat flow, which is
ultimately derived from radioactive decay. If the entire Earth had
as large a concentration of U as the crust the heat flow would be
far higher (and the Earth probably uninhabitable).

See also: http://adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/1979GeCoA..43..709F

You could find many more links of this kind with google. Uranium
concentrations have been measured extensively in the seafloor
around the world, since U is used extensively for radiochemical
dating.


Those numbers would dwarf the worlds current ore mining and refining
operations by at least fifty(50) fold .

By the time we're using 20ppm ore, breeding would probably be justified.
This would reduce the volume by a factor of about 200 (since you'd
be using the thorium as well as the 238U).

Fortunately, there's no need to build breeder reactors anytime soon,
and 20ppm ores won't be mined anytime soon.

We have still centuries or thousands years of low cost extraction
uranium,with no need of reprocessing or breeders (including thorium)

http://www.nci.org/conf/garwin/index.htm
" Of great interest are the terrestrial "reasonably assured resources" of
uranium, which are likely to amount to 100 to 300 million tons of uranium at
a price of $350 per kg (in comparison with the current spot market price of
$20-30 per kg)(21). ( John P. Holdren and R.K. Pachauri, Energy, in ICSU, An
Agenda of Science for Environment and Development Into the 21st Century,
Cambridge University Press, 1992, pp. 103-118.)
Of course, nobody of right mind would buy uranium at $350/kg when the same
material is available at $30/kg, but it is of primary importance to note
that at $350/kg these high-cost terrestrial resources would still be cheaper
than the cost of recycling fuel

Current Yellow cake pricing is at ~249$ per kg.

http://www.uxc.com/review/uxc_Prices.aspx

Their's no evidence that any low grade ores are being tapped.
(I.E. Author did not factor in energy and other inflation factors.)

in an LWR (perhaps $700/kg of natural
uranium avoided) or of building a breeder reactor with a capital cost that
might be double that of an LWR "

Or http://bcsia.ksg.harvard.edu/BCSIA_content/documents/repro-report.pdf
(appendix b "world uranium resources")
More than 250 years at current uranium consumption at a cost of extraction
less than 130 $/kg (no reprocessing and no breeder or thorium)

Referenced pdf claims current uranium consumption of 64,000tonne of U
was @ 2001 and claims 17MtU available at less than $130/KgU ..

Since yellow cake is already at ~$249 kg that prediction is grossly
inaccurate.

P.S. As the number of reactors scale up.. (with no new breeders in the
mix B.T.W) the demands on that limited supply significantly
diminished the useful life time by several fold.


It's worthwhile to note that,although 130 $/kg is for uranium an "high"
price (and of course 350 $/kg,too),they grossly correspond (only
"once-through" cycle) to nearly only 1 and 3 $ per oil barrel equivalent

As noted previously, the current market price of U is already at ~$294
kg, which is ~18% higher than pricing of Yellow cake(remove O8
component).

Note: SWU prices are also climbing much faster than the rate of
inflation.

Lastly.. All nuclear power is heavily subsidized in the form of
shifted liability/damage costs (on to the landowners/public). That
unfunded subsidy exceeds the current value of electrical energy
production by many times over.

With any event whose probability is greater than zero(0), it's not a
question of IF, the only question that remains is WHEN is it going to
occur.
.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: "Nuclear energy not the solution to global warming"
    ... Note that uranium occurs at about 8 ppb by mass, ... If the entire Earth had ... You could find many more links of this kind with google. ... We have still centuries or thousands years of low cost extraction ...
    (sci.energy)
  • Re: "Nuclear energy not the solution to global warming"
    ... over the average U content of the Earth because of this. ... uranium, which are likely to amount to 100 to 300 million tons of uranium at ... a price of $350 per kg (in comparison with the current spot market price of ... than the cost of recycling fuel ...
    (sci.energy)
  • Re: flipping of earths poles
    ... It has to be much more pure than uranium on Earth;s surface. ... Uranium gives the core its high temperature of 11,000 degrees(hotter ... we know the overall density and mass of the Earth based on measurments of how the Earth perturbs the orbits of other planets and the moon. ... we know the overal composition of the Earth by examining the bulk chemical composition of the Sun and by analyzing a class of meteorites known as Chondrites. ...
    (sci.physics)
  • Re: flipping of earths poles
    ... It has to be much more pure than uranium on Earth;s surface. ... Uranium gives the core its high temperature of 11,000 degrees(hotter ... we know the overall density and mass of the Earth based on measurments of how the Earth perturbs the orbits of other planets and the moon. ... we know the overal composition of the Earth by examining the bulk chemical composition of the Sun and by analyzing a class of meteorites known as Chondrites. ...
    (sci.physics)
  • Re: "Nuclear energy not the solution to global warming"
    ... over the average U content of the Earth because of this. ... uranium, which are likely to amount to 100 to 300 million tons of uranium at ... a price of $350 per kg (in comparison with the current spot market price of ... than the cost of recycling fuel ...
    (sci.energy)
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