Re: Mine Safety Subordinated to Mining Company Interests


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> I did in their product literature on the Net. Both are rated to 4 hours,
> consistent with their cooling pack being operational.

The time-ratings are based on a miner activily working in a "maximum hazard"
environment, and are HIGHLY conservative. The 36 hour max is based on more
"practical" data, and the miners being sedentary in a self-constructed
shelter to minimize the gas exposure. This is EXACTLY what the trapped
miners did. They were smart, and did what their safety training taught them
to maximize their chances of survival. The unfortunate facts are that even
with the very best lifeboat.....you can get killed when the boat sinks! You
should note that of the 13 trapped miners, the youngest and lightest man
survived

> Actually, I've had one of these (or something nearly identical) draped on
> my body on a mine visit. According to its spec ***, the W65 is rated to
> 60 minutes at 1% CO, which is consistent with what I was told in my safety
> orientation. (I also use an MSA brand helmet for caving, believe it or
> not, and have for the last 20 years, despite some cave vendors wanting to
> sell me *their* $100+ helmets. )

Me too! Again, the times on the W65 (the "other" unit is probably a
Drager....the Huns invented that little gizmo in the 1920's!) are based on a
highly active 250 lb miner walking/running to get out of the hole. If you
are sedentary, the times are significantly effected.
>
> My point still stands: if the modern SCUBA rebreathers can greatly exceed
> these specifications in extending breathing time (sane divers, being under
> the rule of 1/3s (even for rebreathers), rarely push rebreathers to their
> limits, but hey, an emergency is an emergency) why is that technology not
> being incorporated into SCBA safety equipment for miners?

Ms Shaper.....just how large are these units? How "shelf-stable" are they?
How "user-friendly" are they? Remember, we're talking about building a
"lifeboat", not the QE II....it has to be CORRECTLY used by a guy that's
panicey, already being gassed, and in complete darkness....the BG-4 is
beautifully engineered and about as simple as a paperclip....and men have
all too frequently screwed up getting them on and died as a result!
>


> But there is a big difference between your recreational caver or cave
> diver out for a weekend lark, and the fellow who is underground between 50
> and 72 hours a week as a job--the latter knows the hazards increase just
> simply due the number of hours of exposure. Therefore, it stands to reason
> that person should have much better equipment than the part time cave
> diving enthusiast. Doesn't look like this is the case, though.

Simply because you're mis-stating the case. These are self-rescue systems,
not primary environmental support. The primary systems are multi-million
dollar air-handling systems that are engineered to provide a safe working
atmosphere. The various devices I've mentioned are the "lifeboat" for when
the "primary system" hits an iceberg, not the "cruise ship", and they worked
"as designed" or better in this specific case. Some situations simply don't
lend themselves to "happy outcomes"....coal mining is one of them. Every
"Anti-Nuclear Activist" should spend a shift in a coal mine, and understand
that even with the best technology availible, one man dies for every 80
million tons of coal that comes out of the hole to keep the lights on, your
computer running, and steel rolling out of the mills (which is damn-good
when you consider that the Chinese kill more coal-miners every year than
work underground in the entire US of A!).

John Kepler
Pickands Mather Coal Co.
>
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