Re: Contamination Prompts Ky. Cave Shutdown


"Jo Schaper" <jospamnotschaper34@5socket78dot9net> wrote in message
news:12kt3d9kuqd073c@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
George wrote:
"Jo Schaper" <jospamnotschaper34@5socket78dot9net> wrote in message
news:12ks7urrjrjf2b0@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
First of all they need to determine the strain of E. coli...not all of
them are noxious, and this may be a bit of politic overreaction in
response to the spinach scare of last month.

Not really. The list of contaminants in the drinking water regulations
specifies total coliform (which includes fecal coliform and e.coli).
The total coliform test is used to indicate whether potentially harmful
bacteria may be present. The National Park Service at Mammoth Cave is
very sensitive to pollutants reaching the caves for a variety of
reasons, not the least of which is the fact that hundreds of thousands
of people visit them every year.

True but the tourists aren't drinking the cave water, which was my point.
I've been in Echo River when it had a scum of creosote on it (literally),
and in other cave water much much more polluted than Mammoth Cave.
(Runoff from feedlots, for example, and in waters where others (not me)
have seen TP and actual fecal matter floating downstream. Now, that's not
my favorite variety of caving, but human skin is pretty tough stuff...as
long as you aren't drinking the water or have open cuts, you're likely
not at high risk. Was in one such cave just last week...

The feedlot problems are mostly a thing of the past. The Park Service, in
conjunction with the EPA (region 4) initiated a program to help local
farmers control the run off from their feed lots. It's been very
successful. Oops, I already pointed this out.


I'm curious how this is considered a health hazard, since to my
knowledge, no one is drinking untreated Mammoth Cave water, especially
along the trail. I suppose it is spray from the waterfall.

It probably would scare the tourists to know the E. coli results for
the Green River, too. Surface water in ag country is always high, and
in karst country it is all surface water (even the stuff underground.)

There is an ongoing research program within and outside the park to find
ways to minimize agricultural and other potentially polluted run-off
from entering the karst system, particularly from cattle and dairy
farms. In this particular case, run-off from parking areas within the
park itself may be a suspected source. Sadly, too many people with
campers simply dump their effluent right on the ground if they can get
away with it, and I suspect that may be the source of these
contaminants.

George

Don't know about Mammoth, but I know of a park where they just improved
the campground. Installed electric and water at every site, but no sewer.
Some people complained because of the possible effects on the
groundwater, and lost their jobs over it. I'm not sure you can blame the
campers (esp. stupid city people) if the parks aren't designed well.

I wonder if MCNP is also going to announce the results of their coliform
counts as in what is causing the problem. They may be doing everything as
well as they can, but still don't see why they would shut down the cave
because cave water isn't the cleanest. Is there also an odor problem?

Don't know. I will ask around and see if I can find some answers to your
questions.

It's the outdoors, people (even if it underground). The outdoors is
*dirty*. I've dealt with enough city people irate because no one
chlorinated the the local river, and who demanded a refund because the
park had bugs to realize, as the bumpersticker says, "If it's Tourist
Season, why Can't We Shoot Them?" I'm not saying MCNP should be
unconcerned, but on the other hand, closing that tour still sounds like
an overreaction to me.

Well, if nothing else, they are covering their arses.

George


.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: Contamination Prompts Ky. Cave Shutdown
    ... The list of contaminants in the drinking water regulations specifies total coliform. ... The National Park Service at Mammoth Cave is very sensitive to pollutants reaching the caves for a variety of reasons, not the least of which is the fact that hundreds of thousands of people visit them every year. ...
    (sci.geo.geology)
  • TR-The Inland Northwest Part I
    ... National Park instead. ... parallels the North Fork of the Flathead River. ... The area we stopped at had some pocket water and what looked to be a pretty ... The fish rose again and I saw it was bigger than the others I ...
    (rec.outdoors.fishing.fly)
  • NEWS: Just add water: New amusement park thrills
    ... Just add water: New amusement park thrills ... KINGS MILLS, Ohio -- Smiling and screaming all at once, Joe ... tube slides while the rest of the family swam in the children's pools. ...
    (rec.roller-coaster)
  • Warderick Wells Cay, Exumas April 10-13 2009
    ... Safely at anchor in Warderick Wells, the location of the headquarters of the ... National Park for the Bahamas, the only visible WiFi signals were from the ... allotment determines when you're cut off. ... entire length of the boat to scrub, but the water was very much warmer there ...
    (rec.boats.cruising)
  • Re: Vintage Water Divining manual dowsing 1925 FA
    ... Really rare book by B Tomkins,the famous Water Finder of Thetford .How rare are Water divining manuals? ... a quick look under New Age or Metaphysics will net you dozens of more up to date how-to books on dowsing. ... I've played with them...a number of cavers have used them to 'witch' caves, dug where the rods said, and found cave. ...
    (sci.geo.hydrology)