Re: does anyone here also know Korean or have Korean friends?


Ray wrote:
chance wrote:
"Bart Mathias" <mathias@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote

John knew that Mary disliked him, and so did Tom.

which I, very possibly in my ignorance, cannot take as Tom knowing that
Mary dislikes *him*.

The question is about English.
The question is:
'...so did Tom' can be taken
as 'Tom knew Mary disliked 'Tom',
or as 'Tom knew Mary disliked 'John'.
English is not for me.


The question is not about English per se; it's about the Korean
equivalent of the (imagined)English sentence. (After all, in English,
a reflexive in an object position generally cannot refer
cross-clausally to a matrix-clause subject.)



CK

PS: As led to believe that the 'restoration'
is possible that way, I said 'chagi' means 'Tom'.
In retrospect, I should've said the 'reconstruction'
in question is impossible in the first place IMHO.
Accordingly, I am with Bart.



In retrospect, I think I should've said that "Tom [also] knew that Mary
disliked CAKI" is some sort of metalanguage. Of course, it is verbose
and infelicitous as a common conjuct to "John knew that Mary disliked
CAKI". (Is this the reason why you said you wouldn't restore the
conjucnt that way?)

But this verbose way in which the "restored" conjunct is cast is simply
to make clear what the CAKI could refer to in the 2nd conjunct.

Ray





Anyway, please just examine the exampe kindly furnished by Bart:

John-un Mary-ka caki-lul miwehanun kes-ul alko, Tom-to (ku kes-ul)
alassta

If "so did Tom" could not be restored as "Tom [also] knew that Mary
disliked CAKI", then how would you restore it? (I still don't
understand how "so did John" cannot be restored that way.)

(But I think the question itself is not of direct concern to the
crucial quesition about the referential possibilities of caki.)

The question of concern here is which person Tom knew Mary disliked in
the Korean sentence Bart gave-- Tom himself or John?

I'd appreciate your help.

Ray

.

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