Re: (Japan Times) Navigating the 'keigo' minefield

Cindy wrote:
On Aug 4, 9:03 pm, Richard VanHouten <ric...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Cindy wrote:
On Aug 4, 7:31 pm, ax <anton....@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
I did say Keigo is not my fancy. But I never mention about resorting
to rudeness..
Not using keigo doesn't mean I can't be as polite. It's all in you
aura.
You won't believe this, but if you don't use keigo, you are speaking
rude Japanese. If you don't want to learn keigo, don't start learning
Japanese from the beginning.
I suspect the article (and ax) are speaking only of 尊敬語 and 謙譲語
while you're also speaking of 丁寧語, so you're talking past each other.

This is really stupid. If you want to learn Japanese, you will have
to learn all 3 of them no matter you like them or not. Probably, most
of learners are not successful mastering them. It is one of the
reasons they don't want to use Japanese in public because they don't
want to make mistakes. I know one young man who used them correctly.
He's got to do it since he studied Japanese in the Tokyo University.

However, this is truly a nasty subject to conquer. Japanese learners
from other cultures must make up their minds to learn or quit and go
home. These are all related with Japanese culture. You have to use
the correct language when you face someone special. If you are able
to do that, you are respected. If you can't, you won't get what you
want such as an apartment, a bank account, a credit card, and so on.
I tell you, in Japan, you got to be polite and use correct language if
you want something. Especially when you have to confront to someone,
you'd better be very careful and watch what you say.

When I went to Japan this year, I had many occasions to see Japanese
people's politeness in Tokyo, Hiroshima, and Kyoto. My impression was
that their politeness is rather like "fear" than politeness. In
English speaking world, you can be polite boldly and confidently and
loudly and you are not supposed to show fear to anybody.



The thing is, most foreign learners (at least, those who learned in a
classroom) learn 丁寧語 first - 普通語 might not even be introduced to
them in the first semester. To them, 敬語 includes 尊敬語 and 謙譲語
only - the super-polite parts of Japanese, not the normal politeness of
丁寧語 that they started learning from day 1 of class.
.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: (Japan Times) Navigating the keigo minefield
    ... Not using keigo doesn't mean I can't be as polite. ... Japanese from the beginning. ... the correct language when you face someone special. ... that their politeness is rather like "fear" than politeness. ...
    (sci.lang.japan)
  • Re: (Japan Times) Navigating the keigo minefield
    ... Not using keigo doesn't mean I can't be as polite. ... Japanese from the beginning. ... that their politeness is rather like "fear" than politeness. ... Anything on base I needed to do could be done using English. ...
    (sci.lang.japan)
  • Re: (Japan Times) Navigating the keigo minefield
    ... Not using keigo doesn't mean I can't be as polite. ... Japanese from the beginning. ... the correct language when you face someone special. ... that their politeness is rather like "fear" than politeness. ...
    (sci.lang.japan)
  • Re: (Japan Times) Navigating the keigo minefield
    ... Not using keigo doesn't mean I can't be as polite. ... Japanese from the beginning. ... the correct language when you face someone special. ... that their politeness is rather like "fear" than politeness. ...
    (sci.lang.japan)
  • Re: (Japan Times) Navigating the keigo minefield
    ... Not using keigo doesn't mean I can't be as polite. ... Japanese from the beginning. ... that their politeness is rather like "fear" than politeness. ... Anything on base I needed to do could be done using English. ...
    (sci.lang.japan)