Re: The Phaistos Disk, side A, according to Faucounau (was: Fischer)

From: Qakare (qakare_at_hotmail.com)
Date: 07/14/04 

Date: 14 Jul 2004 08:22:04 -0700

grapheus@www.com (grapheus) wrote in message news:<337ae51f.0407140227.3b0b6878@posting.google.com>...
> qakare@hotmail.com (Qakare) wrote in message news:<dad05270.0407131418.413006d@posting.google.com>...
> > grapheus@www.com (grapheus) wrote in message news:<337ae51f.0407130304.13403605@posting.google.com>...
> > > qakare@hotmail.com (Qakare) wrote in message news:<dad05270.0407120707.773e6ee6@posting.google.com>...
> > > > grapheus@www.com (grapheus) wrote in message news:<337ae51f.0407120050.4c97327f@posting.google.com>...
> > > > > qakare@hotmail.com (Qakare) wrote in message news:<dad05270.0407111640.3bf7b63@posting.google.com>...
> > > > > > grapheus@www.com (grapheus) wrote in message news:<337ae51f.0407110922.193f84bd@posting.google.com>...
> > > > > > > qakare@hotmail.com (Qakare) wrote in message news:<dad05270.0407110038.51dfa70f@posting.google.com>...
> > > > > > > > grapheus@www.com (grapheus) wrote in message news:<337ae51f.0407100802.2f0284e4@posting.google.com>...
> > > > > > > > > qakare@hotmail.com (Qakare) wrote in message news:<dad05270.0407100252.465b5d80@posting.google.com>...
> > > > > > > > > > grapheus@www.com (grapheus) wrote in message news:<337ae51f.0407091507.22fb4761@posting.google.com>...
> > > > > > > > > > If he found the number of signs to high, why then he used so much signs
> > > > > > > > > > with complex values?
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I have to repeat it : any SCRIPT is a COMPROMISE between PHONETIC
> > > > > > > > > ACCURACY and SIMPLICITY!...
> > > > > > > > > Writing KRO instead of KO-RO is PHONETIC ACCURACY... In French,
> > > > > > > > > writing <e> ,<é> and <è> is PHONETIC ACCURACY... Etc. But writing
> > > > > > > > > in Mycenaean KO-RO instead of KRO is SIMPLICITY ... In the Phaistos
> > > > > > > > > Disk, having ONE SIGN to translate TA, DA and THA is SIMPLICITY..
> > > > > > > > > Etc.
> > > > > > > > > Don't always ask "WHY" : Because THINGS are NOT ALWAYS LOGICAL !...
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > In the case of Faucounaus decipherment you are right. It is not
> > > > > > > > logical and must therefore be rejected!
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > IT is PERFECTLY LOGICAL... What is NOT is the WAY people DO TRANSLATE
> > > > > > > SOUNDS into a SCRIPT. And this is a GENERAL PHENOMENON... Why, for
> > > > > > > instance English uses different ways to write a "/i/ long" ?... Do
> > > > > > > you have a LOGICAL explanation ?...
> > > > > >
> > > > > > It's not logical. For instance that /s/ and /r/ occur at the same time
> > > > > > with complex values doesn't make sense.
> > > > >
> > > > > Following *YOUR* opinion !!!
> > > > >
> > > > > > Faucounau read sign 03 as
> > > > > > /sto/. But such a sign is not needed any more in that script. You have
> > > > > > the <s>! Therfore you should write /s-to/ easily as 12-33!
> > > > >
> > > > > You forgot that 12-33 would be read AS-TO, not STO , like 13-1 is read
> > > > > AR-GO(S) !...
> > > > > Your objection is, once more, far-fetched !..
> > > >
> > > > Very funny. Sometimes it's a /as/ sometimes a /s/, depending on what
> > > > Faucounaus likes.
> > >
> > > NO! Following the CONTEXT !... At the BEGINNING of a word, it HAS to
> > > be AS. At the end, it HAS to be -S. As SIMPLE AS THAT !..
> > > But, of course, you IGNORE that in English, for instance, -EA- has not
> > > the same PHONETIC VALUE in "deal" and in "a bear" !... Or that in the
> > > XVIIe century French, the letter S was read sometimes /S/, other times
> > > /F/ , etc...
> > > WHAT A SCANDAL !... These examples show that your POSTULATE concerning
> > > the Orthographic CONSISTENCY is DEADLY WRONG !.. Better IGNORING this
> > > fact, as you IGNORE the *PROOFS* that the Proto-Ionic Solution IS the
> > > ONLY CORRECT ONE, right ?....
> > >
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Moreover, it's ridiculous to start from the POSTULATE - never
> > > > > respected by ANY script in the word!- that ORTHOGRAPHY is ALWAYS
> > > > > "LOGICAL" , with the object of disparaging a decipherment PROVED by a
> > > > > lot of EVIDENCE.
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > We don't talk about orthography! We are talking about the "grid" of
> > > > Faucounaus syllables. This grid is a mix of all kinds of values the
> > > > history of writing knows.
> > >
> > > AND HERE YOU GO AGAIN with your DISPARAGING but FALSE STATEMENTS !!!!
> > > The said "mix of values" is, FOR the CONSONANTS, THE SAME AS IN THE
> > > "CYPRIOT SYLLABIC SCRIPT" . As for the DOUBLE value of the S-sign, you
> > > find the SAME PHENOMENON in the "Cypriot Syllabic Script" also. This
> > > time, a sign has not the TWO values -S and AS- , but the TWO values :
> > > -S and SE- .
> >
> > Foucaunaus AS- and AR- does not fit in his grid.
>
> And WHY it does'n't FIT ?.. Because you SAID it ?...
> Why a GREEK, inventing a script after having see the Egyptian
> Hieroglyphs, who INVENTS an ACROPHONIC SCRIPT, but who NEEDS the
> CONSONANTS -S and -R at the end of the words, would have NOT INVENTED
> signs AS and AR for using them as -S and -R at the end of the words
> ?....
>
> > Similiar to the
> > cypriot syllabic script it has to read as -S and SA- and -R and RA-.
>
> RIDICULOUS !... The Phaistos Disk's Script is NOT the Cypriot Script
> !..
> It's a NORMAL THING that in the Sypriot Script, a scribe, who had THE
> SAME NEED as the Phaistos Disk's scribe to be able to render a final
> -S or -R, DID USE the EXISTING SIGNS of the BORROWED SCRIPT !..

Take a look at Linear B, for what is happened in a borrowed script.
There is even one system, the old one or a new one. No example can be
found in which three types are mixed. But maybe you can give us a
example for such a script.

> It's a different thing with the Phaistos Disk's Script WHICH HAS NOT
> BEEN BORROWED, but invented!...
>
> >
> > Anyway that for instance sign 01 can be read as go, gu, ko, ku, kho
> > and khu is unbelievable.
>
> AND ONCE AGAIN, you are FORGETTING that the Phaistos Disk's Script HAS
> BEEN INVENTED by a PROTO-IONIAN scribe !... ONLY in a Ionic Dialect
> can O and U be almost the same phonemes.
> This WELL-KNOWN PECULIARITY is even the thread which lead J.Faucounau
> to the conclusion that the DIALECT "HAD" to be "IONIC". He has related
> that he found, by Statistical considerations only, that the SCRIPT was
> using the SAME sign for rendering O and U, but TWO different signs for
> rendering etymological "short A" and "long A" . Therefore, he DEDUCED
> that the LANGUAGE should be of a "IONIC TYPE" .....

Right the Phaistos Disk's Script HAS BEEN INVENTED by Faucounau.

If you can't find new arguments, I will stop this thread at this
point.

qakare

Relevant Pages

  • Re: The Phaistos Disk, side A, according to Faucounau (was: Fischer)
    ... inventing a script after having see the Egyptian ... The Phaistos Disk's Script is NOT the Cypriot Script ... rendering etymological "short A" and "long A". ...
    (sci.lang)
  • Re: The Phaistos Disk, side A, according to Faucounau (was: Fischer)
    ... inventing a script after having see the Egyptian ... >> It's a NORMAL THING that in the Sypriot Script, a scribe, who had THE ... >> It's a different thing with the Phaistos Disk's Script WHICH HAS NOT ...
    (sci.lang)
  • Re: The Phaistos Disk, side A, according to Faucounau (was: Fischer)
    ... > grapheus wrote: ... >> script has always followed the natural path of the REDUCTION of the ... Have you ever heard about "LONG TERM VARIATIONS" and "SHORT ... THE scribe APPLIED the "SIMPLICITY-rule": He PUT an -S WHERE IT WAS ...
    (sci.lang)
  • Re: Russian o or Russian a
    ... scribe in both Russian and English, ... records are written in script; ... In Russian school normative handwriting the script 'a' and 'o' are clearly differentiated, but to recognize this difference in individual writers and in the flow of script on the page can be a real challenge. ...
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  • Scribal inconsistencies in Syllabic Writing
    ... This is a FACT OF THE SCRIPT, ... > syllabaries), ... explained by the "Syllabic Cutting" made by the scribe, ... But this doesn't hinder Mr Miguel Carrasquer to write that there are no ...
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