Re: Did the Trojan war really happen the way Homer said it did?

From: Franz Gnaedinger (frgn_at_bluemail.ch)
Date: 07/31/04 

Date: 31 Jul 2004 00:21:12 -0700

frgn@bluemail.ch (Franz Gnaedinger) wrote in message news:<2bf25455.0407292252.6828835c@posting.google.com>...

Field 10 on the Tiryns side of the Phaistos Disk contains
four signs, Evans 26 (with a thorn) 31 (horizontal) 12 2,
Ohlenroth I_ S O S (iota sigma omikron sigma) = equal,
similar

   http://www.seshat.ch/home/tiryns.GIF

The signs have been explained before. A new aspect comes with
Evans 31 in horizontal position. The standing bird in field 7
honors the Bird Goddess of Old Europe, phonetic value K (kappa),
while the flying bird in field 10 honors Zeus, phonetic value
S (sigma), perhaps referring to semnos = honorable, noble,
holy ...; or sebas = pious awe, worship, superiority, majesty.

While the snake of the Bird Goddess of Old Europe was a symbol
of fertility, the snake in the talons of the male bird is
a symbol of victory. Consider the Iliad: when the Trojans
are ready to storm the Danaian wall, an eagle flies up,
holding a snake in his talons - but the beast is still alive
and bites the eagle who lets fall the vermint, what is considered
a bad omen: Hector may successfully storm the wall but never-
theless loose the war, and really does he loose the all deciding
battle when fighting like a mountain snake against the mountain
hawk Achilles. The military aspect of the bird in field 10 is
confirmed by the following emblem of the Argivian Alliance
(Argos Eye) and the soldier.

The I of ISOS is marked with a thorn, making this an important
word, not only for the spiral text, as explained many times
before, but also for the two sigmata in field 10 itself,
namely the flying bird and the soldier, who are equal in that
they are both defending their territory, the bird the inner
area of the disk, the watching soldier its margin.

The bird in field 10 is special, for he flies backward, along
the spiral to the rosette in the center, which is the begin
of the name S EY R = Zeus. The name of Seyr occurs in field 1,
again in field 4, and again when you ignore the spiral and
"fly" directly from the central rosette to the entrance field
19: central rosette = S, following male head = EY, ear of grain
in field 4 = R, so you got SEYR, and the next sign is the bird
in field 10, followed by a bow and an olive twig in field 19,
the entrance field.

Evans 31 shows a falcon or a hawk, while the bird of Zeus
was an eagle. However, these are similar birds, hawks and eagles
belonging to the same ornithological family of the Accipitridae.

Next time: fields 11 and 12 (introducing SLRYNS = Tiryns)

Regards Franz Gnaedinger

> Field 9 on the Tiryns side of the Phaistos Disk contains
> the signs Evans 27 18 32 14 27 12 2, Ohlenroth N S G O N O S
> (ny sigma gamma omikron ny omikron sigma), the end of
> K / Y OU S A / N S, followed by G O N O S
>
> http://www.seshat.ch/home/tiryns.GIF
>
> Kyousans means the women of Zeus, the ones made pregnant
> by him, while gonos means her child, their offspring.
> The kappa of kyousans shows a bird, in honor of the Bird
> Goddess of Old Europe, and accordingly the gamma of gonos
> has to be a bird, since the child or young one of a bird
> is a bird. On the level of the script you may call the
> two birds at the begin of the words a visual alliteration.
> Furthermore kappa and gamma are close. All this supports
> the idea of continuity and noble offspring: the child
> (eponymous Tiryns) being the equal of the shining one
> (Zeus) and his women (descendants of the Bird Goddess
> of Old Europe). The gamma of gonos may come from genea,
> genealogy, genethlae, genethlon, genosis, genetae, genaemma,
> genos. All these words have to do with birth, offspring
> and descendance.
>
> Evans 14, Ohlenroth O (omikron) may be seen as a pair
> of female breasts and may come from oar = wife, woman.
> These would be the breasts that nourish a child, the
> equal of Zeus, whose emblematic animal was the eagle,
> and that is one more reason to start gonos with a bird.
> The swollen breasts are hold by a ribbon or the hem of
> the decollete and are seen from below, about as a baby
> may see them. The pair of breasts are again a symbol
> of equality and symmetry, and the ribbon or hem, which
> is divided in three parts of equal length, may symbolize
> father Zeus, his women, and their offspring. The ancient
> ones had little writing space on a clay tablet or a disk,
> nevertheless they succeeded in saying plenty by making
> it simple yet complex (my formula and key for understanding
> early documents).
>
> Next time: the most fascinating field 10 (isos, equal)
>
> Regards Franz Gnaedinger
>
>
> > Field 8 on the Tiryns side of the Phaistos Disk contains
> > four signs, Evans 19 17 18 6, Ohlenroth Y OY S A, out of
> > kyousans, meaning the wives or literally the ones made
> > pregnant by Zeus:
> >
> > http://www.seshat.ch/home/tiryns.GIF
> >
> > Why are the four signs given separately? They represent,
> > I believe, the former civilization of the Goddess, a memory
> > of which might have survived in Elaia's grove at Phigalia
> > near Lycosoura, where, as I suppose, eponymous Tiryns came
> > from. Several clay objects of the Vinca time might have been
> > kept in the shrine of the Arcadian Elaia Black Demeter Melaina,
> > bearing inscriptions that were no longer readable but may
> > nevertheless have conveyed an idea of the former religious
> > believes.
> >
> > Evans 19, Ohlenroth Y (ypsilon), is a frequent Vinca sign
> > representing the female Y, phonetic value NAE in the Old
> > European Script, but here coincidentally an Y that may
> > refer to hypokyomai = to get pregnant (hypokyomai begins
> > with an aspirated ypsilon).
> >
> > Evans 17, Ohlenroth OY (diphtong omikron ypsilon) may show
> > a handle and refer to ous = ear, handle ... It would be
> > the handle of a jug, a vessel, a basket, which took up
> > the various products of the early agrarian societies ruled
> > by the Goddess of Old Europe.
> >
> > Evans 18, Ohlenroth S (sigma), shows the most frequent sign
> > in the Vinca script, namely an angle, here practically a right
> > angle. The phonetic value in Old European was KE, I believe.
> > This value was forgotten, while the new value on the Phaistos
> > Disk, an S, may refer to sanis = ... scaffold ...; or to saekos
> > = enclosure, stable, sanctuary, shrine ...; or to skaenae = tent,
> > hut, house, garden, temple ... So the angle would be a reference
> > and homage to the shrine and village of the Goddess of Old Europe.
> >
> > Finally, Evans 6, Ohlenroth A (alpha) shows the Goddess herself,
> > Arcadian Elaia Black Demeter Melaina, perhaps referring to
> > agauos = noble, majestic, worthy of praise --- just as Demeter
> > on the gold signet ring from Tiryns, which ring, I believe,
> > commemorates a Middle Helladic fresco or relief:
> >
> > http://www.seshat.ch/home/ring.gif
> >
> > Here you see noble, majestic and praiseworthy Demeter raising
> > a jug in Y-shape, while the four kings raise libation jugs
> > with handles - look how the paw of the king on the right side
> > follows the curve of the handle -, and the shrine of the
> > Goddess is just indicated by a right angle on the left side,
> > behind her throne.
> >
> >
> > Next time: field 9
> >
> > Regards Franz Gnaedinger
> >
> >
> > > The third and last sign in field seven on the Tiryns side of
> > > the Phaistos Disk, Evans 31, Ohlenroth K (kappa), shows a standing
> > > falcon or hawk with a snake.
> > >
> > > http://www.seshat.ch/home/tiryns.GIF
> > >
> > > The same sign appears in other fields in horizontal position,
> > > flying toward the right or the left side, having the same Evans
> > > number 31 but a different phonetic value with Ohlenroth, namely
> > > S (sigma). More about the horizontal sign in a later message,
> > > here I just consider the standing falcon.
> > >
> > > The three signs in field seven yield O I K and are the begin of
> > > O I K Y OU S A N S in SEYR ... OI KYOUSANS GONOS ISOS = Zeus,
> > > to the ones made pregnant by him children are born his equal.
> > > (Pausanias II 6, 3 quotes an Asios fragment with the dat. auct.
> > > for the medial variant: Zaeni te kysamenae kai Epopei, poinmeni
> > > laon.)
> > >
> > > Zeus, having children his equal, surely loved women his equal.
> > > The kappa may then refer to kyria = lady, mistress, while the
> > > bird may refer to kirkos = falcon, hawk. Woman or bird? Both.
> > > Evans 31, I believe, shows the Bird Goddess of Old Europe
> > > that may well have survived in Arcadia at the base of Mount
> > > Lycaion, in the shrine of the Arcadian Demeter Black Melaina,
> > > and the fertility symbol of the Bird Goddess was a snake
> > > (some of you may remember my series of messages on Old Europe
> > > here in this thread in the spring of 2004).
> > >
> > > Now I beg your patience for another mental loop.
> > >
> > > We have three signs in field seven, namely the hypothetical
> > > emblem of a hypothetical Argivian defensive alliance (horkos
> > > Argous), or the Watchful Eye of the Argolis, or simply Argos
> > > Eye (opsis Argous), followed by the horn, which is, I believe,
> > > a sign of equality or symmetry, followed by the standing bird,
> > > which may commemorate and honor the goddess of Old Europe.
> > > Reading the three signs as an equation we see that eponymous
> > > Tiryns equals the new society in the Argolis with the old one
> > > in Arcadia, or he states a symmetry between them, says that
> > > both religions have their merits and are on a par, thus
> > > honoring the old ways and making them useful for his agrarian
> > > untertakings in the Argolis. That equation or symmetrization
> > > of old and new religion was, I believe, the reason for separating
> > > the K-sign from the following signs of K / Y OU S A / N S.
> > >
> > > Next time I shall explain the signs in field eight (Y OU S A).
> > > They honor, I believe, the civilization of Old Europe.
> > >
> > > Regards Franz Gnaedinger

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