Re: shirt in Hindi

"Ruud Harmsen" <realemailseesite13@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> a écrit
dans le message de news:
3ir0811j69o0bt0fui447j96nrhmng3a4h@xxxxxxxxxx
> Tue, 10 May 2005 05:16:22 +0200: "G. Leo Sahakian"
<glsah@xxxxxxx>: in
> sci.lang:
>
> >it *is* persian, as the g shows; in skr. it is gharma,
> >coresponding to el. thermós, la. formus < pie. *ghwermos; gh is
> >reduced to g in iranian; fa. (pers., farsi) gärm; the 2d a in
hi.
> >garam is a hi. innovation as often happens i consonant
clusters;
>
> I see. Must be cognate with English, Dutch warm and German
wärme.

warm is German too.
Duden Herkunftsw'buch doesn't mention gharmá under warm; it links
the latter with ru. varítj boil, lt. virti id., hy. var.em kindle;
my Dutch etym. dict. doubts that *gwh (not ghw, as I wrote
previously) becomes w in Germanic.
I am not so sure; I shall represent labialised velars by k° (alii
q), k°h, g°, g°h; and Go. hw (which is _one_ letter) by h°; J.
Wright, Grammar of the Gothic Language, 1910, states that g°h
becomes w in Germanic, only example given being go. warmjan, ge.
wärmen, to warm; strictly speaking sa. gharmá m. "heat" does not
correspond exactly with el. thermós hot; mo- is apparently a
suffix: cf. théros n., summer, heat, hy. j`er hot, like j`erm
(j`=dzh); so the root would be *g°her.
*g°h turns into ph in el., but to th before a front vowel;
similarly it becomes gh in sa. but h before a front vowel (even if
this, if e, appears as "a" in historical sa.; so we have to
reconstruct gharmáh. as g°hermós; now I am at a loss with fa. garm
adj.; shouldn't it be *jarm or *zarm to tally with thermós?
taking into account fa. garm and Germanic warm ( < *warmaz) we can
admit that *g°hermos had a synonym *g°ormos.
garm is spelt grm in arabo-pers. script, which can be read
g{a|i|u}r{a|i|u| }m, i.e. g+a or i or u+r+a or i or u or
nothing+m; in fact there are only 2 words with this spelling: garm
and gurm; I don't know if the reading garam exists in fa. as a
variant.
as for hi., the oxford hi.-en. dict. has 2 spellings in
devana:gari: : garama (main entry) and garma, both transcribed
garm without svarabhakti.

> --
> Ruud Harmsen - http://rudhar.com

<ranjit_mathews@xxxxxxxxx> a écrit dans le message de news:
1115758047.928353.163320@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> [...]
> since
[a"] and [@] were
> represented by different graphemes. Spelt in Persian script, and
> transliterated in toto to Indian scripts, its pronunciation is
not
> clear from the spelling. Even so, in formal pronunciation, the
original
> vowels are retained (assuming that it was [ga"r@xxxx] in
Avestan). If
> it is by retaining phonological rules that the pronunciation is
> retained (i.e., that it is not pronounced ,say, [ga"ra"m]), then
what I
> want to know is what is/are the rule/rules that make the first
/a/ [a"]
> and the second /a/ [@].

will someone please explain to me what all these quotes (") mean;
in sampa " before a syllable means stress; them what am I to
understand from [ga"ra"m]? TIA.

<ranjit_mathews@xxxxxxxxx> a écrit dans le message de news:
1115466464.454437.11260@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> John Atkinson wrote:
> > "Allan Adler" <ara@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote...
> > >
> > > I'm reading "Teach Yourself Hindi" and have just learned
that the
> word
> > > for "shirt" is "qemiz".
>
> The typical transliteration in Indian English is "kameez".
>
> > > This reminds me of the French word "chemise"
> > > and I'm wondering whether it is a coincidence. The book
mentions
> that
> > > the words with q or z are generally of foreign origin.
> >
> > No, it's not a coincidence. Germanic hemidi > Celtic (?) and
OE
> cemes >
> > late Latin camisa > Greek khamassa > Arabic qamis, qamus >
Persian >
> > Hindi

what is this qamus? ar. qa:mu:s (< el. o:keanós) = dictionary.
>
> I've only heard it pronounced [ka"mi:z] rather than [qa"mi:s],
which
> seems to indicate an origin from Portugese rather than Persian
although
> there is conceivably also a similar Urdu word [qa"mis] with
origin from
> Persian.

the dictionary has qami:z; if the z points to pt., the q points
instead to ar.
is there a word accent in hi., like [ka"mi:z]? no grammar I have
seen mentions the fact.

"Douglas G. Kilday" <fufluns@xxxxxxxxxx> a écrit dans le message
de news: 427d374f_3@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>[...]
> Germanic *hemidi- (whence OHG <hemidi>, NHG <Hemd(e)>)

Germanic *hamiþia
> could represent a borrowing from Gaulish *camitya before the
sound-shift;


"Brian M. Scott" <b.scott@xxxxxxxxxxx> a écrit dans le message de
news: 73wbmc6c8efr$.1fp7czs2xvr65.dlg@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>[...] German <h> gave <c> in
> OFrench, through Frankish <ch>.
>[...]
> Brian

ge. h never gives c or ch in fr.: honnir, honte, harangue, haut (h
nach de. ho:ch, go. hauhs < *hauhaz), hardi, heaume, héraut,
hareng etc.

G. Leo Sahakian
--
Be kind to animals; they owe you nothing. Let them live in peace,
unless
your life is at risk.
http://www.pour-les-animaux.de/.







.

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