Re: The Spanish Language in the US- Taboos and Complexes.


Neeraj Mathur wrote:
"mb"

I was particularly surprised by the assertion that getting replies in
Spanish in Argentina was supposed to prove the point about 'racist
Hispanics' in the US. What exactly would one expect people in Argentina to
reply in if not Spanish? That seemed to me like a particularly obtuse sort
of linguistic imperialism (one which many North Americans have espoused, and
in the process often created resentment about their countries when
travelling).

Most of the time it's done in perfectly good faith: Multi-generation
monolinguals in this country have no exposure to the very basics of how
language works in different situations; the existence of a non-Anglo
world is not really acknowledged by the ambient culture (or average
education). Caricatural simplification on my part, of course. But the
poster still has a point, considering the show-off value that answering
a stranger in English has in much of today's world.
.....
In the US, people in insecure social conditions are very touchy about
not being confused with that just-got-off-the bus lowest stratum,
especially if they do belong to it. In English-speaking areas (includes
Tijuana and PR!), *not* being talked to in Spanish is a mark of
consideration and being addressed in Spanish is felt as insulting ("I
am not a dishwasher wetback who doesn't understand a word of English").

I think this is all exactly correct.

I can add one other point to this. I have met the occasional South Asian
who, although he has claimed to have lived most of his life in cities like
Delhi or Karachi, has pretended not to understand me when I spoke in
Hindi/Urdu. Pretended not even to recognise the language being used. I think
it's probably pretty much impossible to grow up in Delhi and avoid knowing
some Hindi; the thing was that these people all spoke excellent English and
probably felt insulted by the idea that somebody would want to speak to them
in another language.

The interesting thing is that these people were not from poorer classes -
rather the opposite, they were quite wealthy and successful. But that was
the point: the wealthy and successful in South Asia are expected to speak
English, which is (was) a status symbol and a mark of education. This is
certainly true of my grandparents' generation; the people I was talking to
in the West were of roughly my parents' generation (so born in the 50's or
60's). Some of the most severe examples I know are family members who
actually live in Jaipur! The English language is not the only thing; they
generally favour anything 'Western' and censure anything 'Indian'.

This isn't only Asian. Any openly colonial conditions would promote
just that. The now-disappearing cosmopolitan communities of the
Mediterranean Levant had just that, from Benghazi to Alexandria to
Beirut to Constantinople. Families with multiple first languages
(always including French), freely intermarrying within a mosaic of
minorities but never with the colonized majority group, educated at
foreign (again, mainly French) schools. Full competence in the main
local language was not rare but seldom acknowledged. The local language
remained reserved for intercourse with the greengrocer and some local
authorities. Plus a sliver of privileged "locals" behaving as if they
were part of the colonial stratum. I suppose the last generation to
grow up in that speech environment was mine. Interestingly, this
microclimate existed since before the fall of Constantinople, when
Venetian power started recruiting local non-Turkish "elites".

most impressed when I say I'm studying Latin and Greek at Oxford; they are
most disgusted when I mention that I'm also studying Sanskrit.

Figures.

(And by the
way, I'm studying none anymore - last exam was on Thursday, I'm done!!!
Thanks to everybody who sent me good vibes!)

Would be most disappointing if you were done studying.

To tie this into an earlier thread, it is these sorts of people who are
likely to be most offended if called 'desi': they would consider speaking
Hindi or Panjabi or so on as being 'desi' - rural, uneducated, poor, working
class - while speaking English is urbane and sophisticated. They would
probably use desi to describe other South Asian immigrants who don't speak
English as well as they do, and anything that, in general, is Indian and not
Western.

.

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