Re: Warter, warter everywhere

Bart Mathias wrote:

Mike Wright wrote:

Bart Mathias wrote:

ranjit_mathews@xxxxxxxxx wrote:

Greg Lee wrote:

I say [waDr] (ending in flap D and syllabic r),

Why do you call it a syllabic r rather than a vocalic r? A flapped D
seems implausible in contexts other than intervocalic. AFAIK, a
syllabic r would be the terminal trill in the typical pronunciations of
Russian <aleksandr> and Farsi <madr>.

Good point, I think. The ("preferred") pronunciation of the English word "err" is one syllable of nothing but "r," but it would seem odd to call it "syllabic r," like calling the pronunciation of the name of the letter "E" "syllabic i."

I agree about /r/ being "vocalic". I rhyme "err" with "air" /Er/, where I take /r/ to be a glide. (My /r/ is bunched, not retroflex.)

However, the point of the term "syllabic" seems to be that what is typically considered to be a consonant is being used as the core of a syllable (there must be a term for this), as if it were a vowel. Since /i/ is already a vowel, there is no need to call it "syllabic".

"R" is as much a consonant in "rue" and "air" as "y" is in "you" or "hay," but hardly in "err" rhymed with "her," unless you want to consider the deeper retroflexion or bunching at the end than at the beginning to be the sign of an off-glide.

I tend to think of my "r" as a glide whenever it's not syllabic, and I feel the same way about the "y" in "you" and "hay".

Being uneducated in this area, I probably shouldn't have opinions on the matter--but I'm weak.

I'm speaking of the usual American-style rhotic English, of course. If you trill, that's another matter. I wonder who can do a syllabic tapped "r"?

--
Mike Wright
http://www.raccoonbend.com
.

Relevant Pages

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