Re: Warter, warter everywhere

ranjit_mathews@xxxxxxxxx wrote:
Mike Wright wrote:

ranjit_mathews@xxxxxxxxx wrote:


Mike Wright wrote:


I tend to think of my "r" as a glide whenever it's not syllabic,

The glide in moor/Moore is spelt oor/oore, not spelt r/re.

Are you saying that there is no vowel in those words? Or does "glide"
mean something different for you than it does for me?

There are vowels in there but to me, a glide means, at a minimum, two
vowels and the transition from the first to the second. That is, the
first vowel is the beginning of the glide and the second vowel is the
end of it.

It's probably time for some of the linguists here to step in, but my understanding is that "vowel" refers to the nucleus of a syllable, while a "glide" is a non-nuclear vowel-like sound that leads to or from a vowel (on-glides and off-glides).

So, a one-syllable word will have at least a vowel, which may optionally be preceded by an on-glide and/or followed by an off-glide, forming a vocalic core that may optionally be preceded and/or followed by a consonant or consonant cluster. In English, the glide /j/ is similar to the vowel /i/, and the glide /w/ is similar to the vowel /u/. I think that there should be a vowel-glide pair for the sound often written <r>, too.

I suspect that it's not quite that simple. I'm not sure how to take the supposed syllables in reconstructions of Middle and Old Chinese that appear to have vowel clusters (e.g., /srean/), glide clusters (/gjwang/), and even both (/jwieng/). These examples are from the _Introduction to Chinese Historical Phonology_ that Dylan Song posted.

Perhaps someone can explain what *that* is all about.

How about the uir in Muir? Do you find it a glide from [i] to [u] to
[@]?

I've never spoken that name in my life, and don't really recall ever
having heard it, although I've seen it written plenty of times. I had to
look at a dictionary to find the pronunciation, since I couldn't even
guess it from the spelling.

I suppose I'd say something like [mjur], consonant-glide-vowel-glide.

--
Mike Wright
http://www.raccoonbend.com
.

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