Re: taras
- From: "Peter T. Daniels" <grammatim@xxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: 27 Oct 2006 10:04:59 -0700
Franz Gnaedinger wrote:
Franz Gnaedinger wrote:
Franz Gnaedinger wrote:
Douglas G. Kilday wrote:
I doubt that the place in Bithynia, with its thematic inflection, has
anything to do with Taras in Magna Graecia, which is an nt-stem. This
fact makes me think that Taras is native Greek. A borrowing from
Illyrian or some other indigenous language would be unlikely to have
-a:s (from *-ants) in the nom., -antos in the gen., etc. In fact
<Tara:s> reminds of <tala:s> 'enduring, suffering, wretched' whose
inflection usually follows <mela:s> but which has forms preserved by
Hipponax and Callimachus indicating that it was originally a
participial nt-stem, the verb being represented by <etalasa> 'I
endured' etc., poetic 1st aor. beside the usual 2nd aor. <etle:n>, from
PIE *telH2-. I suspect that <Tara:s> is the participle of an obsolete
Greek verb derived from PIE *terH2- 'to pass through, overcome'.
Applied to the river, Taras could refer to its passing through a range
of hills or other obstacles on its way to the sea, or to its providing
an overland passage for tradesmen wishing to avoid the sea-route
through the Straits of Messina. Applied to the son of Poseidon, the
name might simply be an epithet 'The Overcomer' or the like having
nothing to do with the river or the city named after it.
Pleased to read that PIE *terH2- means to pass through,
overcome. Suits me fine, as my hypothetical Magdalenian
TYR means he who overcomes, inverse RYT means a spear
thrower. TYR may be combined with ARC for cave bear:
ARC TYR --- he who overcomes (tyr) a cave bear (arc).
This would be the origin of Arthur, a dragon slayer - remains
of the long extinct cave bear Ursus spelaeus have been
regarded as remains of dragons. TYR would have become
a halfgod of justice and war in the region of Armenia, where
he was linked or even identified with Heracles (see the
Proceedings of the Annual International Indo-European
Conference at the University of California, volume 14 or 15
or 16) This halfgod became the nordic Tyr, god of justice
and war, also Greek tyrant. Inverse RYT became ancient
Greek rhytaer, spear thrower. Tarent lies between the Ionian
Sea and the Mar Piccolo that forms kind of a "cave" on the
map, evoking ARC TYR as the one who overcomes a cave
bear, which, in this case, would have been ships captured in
the Mar Piccolo. The halfgod Taras was the son of Poseidon,
originally a river god, then the god of the seas, alternately
Taras was considered the son of Heracles, who was
associated or even identified with Tyr ...
An addendum: the mother of Taras was the nymph Satyrion.
Her name contains the word Tyr. You may also think of the
satyrs, who came from wooded mountains and "overcame"
nymphs in their sleep. "Satyr" would combine SA and TYR.
Magdalenian SA means downward, and TYR he who overcomes
- satyrs coming down from their wooded mountains and making
love to sleeping nymphs (overcoming them sexually). There is
still a Torre Satyrion near Torent, reminding of Taras' mother.
The original name of the nypmh was Satura. Plautus uses
satura in the sense of pregnant. Saturn may come from
Etruscan saterne. If the name of the God of sawing comes
from SA TYR, he was the one who overcame (with fertility)
from above ...
<u> and <y> are alternative transliterations of Upsilon. Satura IS
Satyra.
.
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