Re: some more Irish vowels

John Atkinson wrote:

Phonetically, Mary is most certainly not merry with a centralizing
glide.

Phonetically, it certainly is, in my dialect. Likewise in RP, and, as far as I know, other non-rhotic southern Brit. I assume you're not referring to these, though, but to your own variety, which, you seem to be implying, is "standard" in the sense that anyone who doesn't know what you mean can't speak English.

I think y'all are being obtuse on purpose, this time. Peter has - I think - explained 'Mary' is the name (he | the people involved in such discussions) give to the reasonably small vowel space used to realise that phoneme in a majority of the AmE dialects that distinguish it. Moreover, the label 'Mary' is used because no other unambiguous way of referring to it has been devised. If anyone else's vowel in the word 'Mary' can be adequately described by other means (cf. 'merry with a centralizing glide') then ipso facto the discussion isn't about it.

Originally, he had said the irish 'yearning' had that same (Peter's 'Mary') vowel. No discussion of phonemes intended. If at some time that wasn't clear, he explained it afterwards.

In case anyone wonders why I got to write the above, it's a possibly vain attempt to avoid yet another unending thread with people talking at cross-purposes.
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