Re: Fr/lat/ru tu-vous/tu-vos/ - : etymology ?

On Sep 30, 12:20 am, benlizross <benli...@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

The fact that "och, aye" means "oh, yes" is just an illusion then?

Sorry if I gave a wrong impression. I'll try again.
Hypothetical Magdalenian OC for the right eye
and AY for the left eye would have survived in
the affirmation och aye in Scottland, and och aye
would have reached America in the seventeenth
century. A late Magdalenian tribe reached Göbekli
Tepe in southeast Anatolia some 12,000 years ago.
May it be that some went farther east and reached
North America? may Choctaw okeh or -oke or -okii
have its origin in the above Magdalenian words?
If so, we should expect derivatives of OC and AY
also in other native American languages. Then
there is a new hypothesis that some rather
small groups of Magdalenians reached New
Foundland during the Ice Age, when the level
of the sea was about hundred meters lower
than today, and the shelf in front of Greenland
and New Foundland free of water, passable.
Also in this case the words OC and AY would
have reached North America and might have
survived in at least one language. However,
okeh hoke -oke -okii might also have another
origin: it could have been for example Italian
occhio 'eye', a word absorbed by the natives
and integrated into their thesaurus: occhio
- eye - I saw it with my own eyes, it is so
and not otherwise: okeh oke hoke -oke -okii.
Or the resemblance of the Choctaw affirmation
to 'och aye' from hypothetical OC and AY is
a mere coincidence. I found only very meagre
Choctaw dictionaries on the Web (maybe one
or the other edition of Byington's dictionary
is kept in my main library), and among the
short list of nouns I found Luac for fire.
Now this word could either have a Magdalenian
origin in LIC for light, luck, Latin lux, German
Licht leuchten, Italian luce, Spanish and
Protuguese luz. Or it could be a Muskogee
loan from Italian luce. Then there is Choctaw
chokke for house, that might perhapsly be
a derivative of Magdalenian KOD for hut,
although it is pronounced cho-ke. It would be
rather difficult to derive that word from KOD,
but not impossible I think. The test I spoke of
would be to look out for possible derivatives
of OC and AY in further native American
languages - at least this was my idea from
yesterday afternoon; already in the evening
I realized that also loans from European
languages could in principle account for
Choctaw okeh which means: it is so and
not otherwise (Wright and Byington).
Its origin could well have been Italian
occhio 'eye': I saw it with my own eyes,
and I can tell you _it is so and not otherwise_.
No test, then. My only test are you, the front
of sci.languers against me: I carry the ball,
will I get through the lines and the throng?
can I go for a touch down? Until now I made it,
so I go on. I mean I am ten times worserly
than Al Gross, whom you and Brian M. Scott
and Peter T. Daniels made leave sci.lang,
whereas I survive, dribbling around Peter,
occasionally body-checking Brian, while
you have been so kind to leave me in peace.
You are well allowed to ignore my Magdalenian
experiment, although I estimate your posts
and your solid knowledge in many realms.

Franz Gnaedinger


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