Re: Illyrian prefix an-
- From: "Douglas G. Kilday" <fufluns@xxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Mon, 31 Dec 2007 16:37:38 -0800 (PST)
Franz Gnaedinger wrote:
"Douglas G. Kilday" wrote:
The root of Sapis (now Savio) is *sap-, as shown by the Tribus Sapinia
of Umbrians dwelling around the river, with their principal town at
*Sapinium (now Sapigno). The river-name cannot be decomposed as SA-
PIS.
What about a contraction of Sap- and -pis to Sapis?
To render that plausible, you would have to find other examples of
rivers in -pis, show that *sap- would be attached without a connecting
vowel, and then show that *Sappis would indeed be reduced to Sapis in
the language spoken there, using other examples. A tall order!
Pistoriae (also -ia, -ium, now Pistoia) is probably simply
'Bakersville', from Latin <pistor> 'baker'. Of course, the Latin name
of the place might be a paretymological deformation, but I have no
idea what the original would have been, and no basis for guessing
anything.
Also possible, but with all the other Pis-names around,
many of them referring to water, I still prefer the meaning
of water in motion. TOR means a bull in motion. PIS TOR
could then be water in motion, bull in motion, water rushing
with the force and power of a bull, for example - just a fancy
idea, should have to know more about the region and the
river, and specifically about the river in early times.
Etruscan for 'bull' was <thevru> (borrowed, in my opinion, from a pre-
Italic IE language). If this formed part of an Etruscan toponym, the
diphthong -ev- should have been Latinized as -eu- (like the Ager
Teuranus), unless it was Latinized or Italicized before -eu- became -
ou-, in which case we would expect -u:- in Latin. Your idea provides
no good reason to reject the simple 'baker' explanation.
I have no etymological information on Pisoraca (now Pisuerga). The
ending is apparently identical to that of Arriaca, a town of the
Arevacae nearby. Menendez Pidal mentions other towns of the Carpetani
in -aca (now mostly -aga, of course), but that provides no help on the
Pisor- part.
Aha, -oraca, a gold word again, golden river ...
Not here, because no pre-Latin rhotacism is attested here. Also, as
Schuchardt emphasizes, the penultimate -a- of Pisoraca was short
(Pisorga 905, Esp. Sagr. tom. XXXVII), so the formation is not Celtic
and cannot be Latin in imitation of Celtic either (like the estate-
names in -a:cum). Pisoraca is probably either Iberian or Basque.
Schuchardt identifies the first element of Arriaca as Basque <(h)arri>
'stone' (also in French Bq. Harriague, cf. Harriette with different
suffix). But I still have no clue as to *pisor-.
Etruscan F- and V- are not interchangeable. Apart from the suffix -
na, Felsina has nothing to do with the family name Velzna, the basis
of Velznal 'Volsinii' (now Orvieto; the inhabitants were forcibly
removed and resettled at Volsinii Novi, now Bolsena). Velz-na cannot
be divided as VEL-ZNA.
Then you must tell Wikipedia about it, they say Felsina
Bologna came from Velzna.
I don't have time to edit Wikipedia. You have access to a large
library, and you are better off getting your Etruscan information from
reputable journals like _Studi Etruschi_ rather than Wikipedia.
.
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