Re: k-like sounds in English and other European languages

In article
<aceb13ca-28a2-4990-98b3-eae2fba38ce4@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,
analyst41@xxxxxxxxxxx wrote:

On Oct 15, 7:10 pm, Harlan Messinger
<hmessinger.removet...@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
analys...@xxxxxxxxxxx wrote:
On Oct 15, 3:52 pm, Nathan Sanders <nsand...@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
In article
<fcdb3631-1eeb-4531-8e04-89fc0c448...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,

 analys...@xxxxxxxxxxx wrote:
On Oct 12, 8:50 pm, analys...@xxxxxxxxxxx wrote:
On Oct 12, 7:16 pm, Nathan Sanders <nsand...@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
In article
<d1fca8d2-3b81-4b29-b0ec-4c3e962d8...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,
 analys...@xxxxxxxxxxx wrote:
On Oct 12, 11:09 am, Nathan Sanders <nsand...@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
In article
<3cf71891-3aaa-4387-a926-c686d9ddc...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,
 analys...@xxxxxxxxxxx wrote:
"breakdown" with a k-sound will break down - it is unstable.  If
someone were to say breagdown or iddoes in everyday speech I doubt
that anybody would find it noticeable.
A voiceless coda, like the [k] in "breakdown" is typically
glottalized, while a voiced coda is never glottalized.
Furthermore, a voiced coda causes the preceding vowel to be much
longer than a vowel preceding a voiceless coda.  The difference in
vowel length is so noticeable to English speakers that it allows
for
distinguishing between words like "beat" and "bead" in whispered
(unvoiced) speech.
If you look at the following consonant clusters in English, it seems
to me that
(1) kt
(2) kd
(3) gt
(4) gd
Only (1) Where k can stand for (c, ck etc.) can occur in a single
word
- all the others can only occur in compound words or at word
boundaries.
(2) anecdote
(4) amygdala
anecdote is a borrowed compound word and "anegdote" in everyday speech
wouldn't be noticeable, IMO.
an- "not" + ekdotos "published," from ek- "out" + didonai "to
give" (see date (1)). Procopius' 6c. Anecdota, unpublished memoirs
amygdala doesn't have the unvoiced-voiced apposition conflict and
amazingly appears not to be a compound word.
The aesthetically challenged ng. inmates have let this slide (not
surprisingly) but 'amygdala' doesn't look like a monomorphemic IE
word.
Whatever it "looks like" (to you), it is in fact a monomorphemic
*English* word.

Nathan

--
Nathan Sanders
Linguistics Program
Williams Collegehttp://wso.williams.edu/~nsanders/-Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

A poor attitude for a researcher.  One should use all available
information about the topic being investigated.

All relevant available information is that it's a monomorphemic English
word. How many times does it have to be pointed out to you that people
aren't processing the ancient histories of the words they use as they
speak? When was the last time you thought about "above" being "an-" +
"be-" + "ufan" when using the word?- Hide quoted text -

It explains how the 'gd' cluster got into the word in the first
place.

Modern English speakers weren't around when this cluster "got into the
word in the first place", so the explanation you are looking for
doesn't explain anything of relevance to them.

To blithely annouce "amygdala' as an English word containing
it shows a sad lack of intellectual curiosity.

You seem to be confusing synchronic and diachronic linguistics.

Either modern native English speakers can/do pronounce words with a
[gd] cluster, or they can't/don't. Where those words come from, and
when they might have entered the language, isn't relevant.

(unless one feels English is phonological rubbish with no
rhyme or reason behind its sounds)

Nonsense. There is plenty of rhyme and reason behind the sound
patterns of English (or any language). What do you think synchronic
phonology is concerned with?

Nathan

--
Nathan Sanders
Linguistics Program
Williams College
http://wso.williams.edu/~nsanders/
.

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