Re: Reflections on Free Will and Proposed Perfect Knowledge of God
- From: "David" <da5id65536@xxxxxxxxx>
- Date: 31 Jan 2007 09:00:53 -0800
Uh oh. I didn't expect that "get up" would be interpreted as wake
up. I meant "get out of bed." I have a way of insuring that I can
wake by 8.
To your point: essential to those who hold that they have free will is
belief in some degree of self control. Unpredictability does not
equal free will. Believers in free will claim some degree of self-
control.
David
On Jan 31, 5:03 am, Stephen Harris <cyberguard-1...@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
David wrote:
I've recently seen some definitions of "free will" which seemed to
miss the point--from my point of view. Here's what I mean by "free
will."
proposition E = "I'll get up at 8."
proposition C = "E and not-E are both possible"
C is what I mean by "free will."
(1) C.
(2) God knows everything.
(3) God knows C.
In short, either I don't have free will, or God doesn't know when I'll
get up tomorrow morning.
I had a prof. in college that tried Boethius's idea that God lives in
a timeless realm on me. So what? The issue is not **when** God knows
something. It's whether that knowledge is infallible. If God knew/
knows/will know/timelessly knows that I won't get up at 8, and God
infallibly knows everything, then I won't get up at 8.
A bit off the subject, but if this is a deterministic universe (if
everything that happens is inevitable), I can' t be right--though some
people would give me an argument on this point too.
Does anyone see a good reason to argue with my definition of "free
will"? I can see I'll have to point out that my "will" isn't always
completely free all the time, but I do believe I often make choices.
I do believe I can get up at 8--or not.
David
A standard belief for those who think the universe is deterministic
would be that free will means that some event is unpredictable.
So that it might be completely determined whatever time you wake
up, but if you are unaware of that time, then you have free will.
So both E and not-E can still be possible from your perspective.
From Plato's Allegory of the Cave to Kant we don't know true reality.
There is no proof of God nor a proof for the theory of evolution.
I don't think anybody knows for sure if we have free will, or
that the universe is deterministic and that determinism means
we have no free will, because there are body/mind dualists.
Accepting quantum theory doesn't settle the issue either.
Some religious belief says God wills us to have free will and
other religious beliefs says that we are fated/kismet and still
others that we are both pre-ordained and have free will. :-)
Some have God who started the universe but never later intervenes.
The Scientific paradigm weakened the classical teleological view.
A man of means by no means king of the road,
Stephen
.
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