Re: JSH: Funding, real world, not fantasy

From: fishfry (BLOCKSPAMfishfry_at_your-mailbox.com)
Date: 12/18/04 

Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2004 17:29:29 GMT

In article <uu88s0ls12ugeheups9j9i8tm4cbhvkqk0@4ax.com>,
 David C. Ullrich <ullrich@math.okstate.edu> wrote:

> On Fri, 17 Dec 2004 19:10:16 -0500, "Tim Peters" <tim.one@comcast.net>
> wrote:
>
> >[Tim Peters]
> >>> [snipped another repetition of JSH's standard "Ullrich rant"]
> >>>
> >>> ...
> >>>
> >>> [Will Twentyman]
> >>>> Here's an idea: post links to the relevant articles so we can see the
> >>>> facts for ourselves. You have been proven to be less than credible
> >>>> about matters of (recent) history.
> >
> >[Tim]
> >>> http://groups-beta.google.com/group/sci.math/msg/3ecc5fc09d753b64
> >>>
> >>> Of course there's no slur to be found. "The incident" referred to
> >>> was in early October of 1999. You can find it easily. David
> >>> Ullrich was truly pissed at JSH for calling him a liar repeatedly,
> >>> and "a lapdog" at one point. JSH even apologized for that. As
> >>> David has explained endlessly ever since, he thought that delivering
> >>> "some sort of racial slur" (that's as specific as it ever got) would
> >>> be an object lesson in *why* people shouldn't talk about other
> >>> people the way JSH did. But he didn't do so. He said he thought it
> >>> would have been appropriate to do so, and that's the extent of it.
> >
> >
> >[David Kastrup]
> >> You are already falling victim to JSH's propaganda.
> >
> >It seems to me that when I was younger, people generally showed more skill
> >in applying Occam's Razor <wink>.
> >
> >> Here is the sentence: "But I do recall that the "game" you were playing
> >> was such that it seemed to me a perfectly appropriate reply would be
> >> some sort of racial slur - someone talked me out of that." Note that
> >> Ullrich _never_ claimed that a racial slur was appropriate in any way,
> >> he said that a racial slur seemed to fit with what JSH was dealing out:
> >> and this exactly because it was inappropriate to start with.
> >
> >As you just quoted, "some sort of racial slur" "seemed to me" "a perfectly
> >appropriate reply". Unless you attach surprising meaning to the difference
> >between "a" and "some sort of" here, "Ullrich _never_ claimed that a racial
> >slur was appropriate in any way" just doesn't jibe with the quote calling
> >"some sort of racial slur" "a perfectly appropriate reply".
> >
> >I understand and appreciate the different contexts in which "appropriate"
> >can be applied here, and I *believe* I understand what David meant at the
> >time: that responding to JSH's baseless hurtful insults with "some sort of
> >racial slur" would be a reply-in-kind that perhaps JSH could understand --
> >not specifically to hurt him, but as a way to get him to understand how his
> >hurtful words sometimes made others feel. That's arguably appropriate so
> >far as it goes. I happen to believe it's always wrong to use such speech in
> >public, and from that more-distant view it would have been inappropriate to
> >my eyes had he done so. Since he didn't so, I figure to his eyes too.
>
> Congratulations, you got it.
>
> Of course, some might say that you don't really deserve a lot of
> smartness points for having figured out something that I've explicitly
> stated several times. But considering the difficulty some others
> (well, one other) seems to have here...

David, you are the one who evidently brought race into the conversation
... in a sly, backhanded way. You should apologize and move on. JSH is
right on this one.

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