Re: Additional Info. about statins


"Bill" <xxx@xxxxx> wrote in message
news:YkPqe.8274$jS1.8168@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>
> "Sharon Hope" <shope@xxxxxxxx> wrote in message
> news:D4KdnVMQuZts1zbfRVn-ug@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> Bill,
>>
>> Did you also chastize the AHA, NHLBI and ACC for warning about the danger
>> of muscle pain?
>
> No. I've have not seen all they wrote, but I'm guessing it was fair. I
> would warn people about the risks too. Only in a fair way. Why do you
> think that is relevant?
>

Statin muscle damage, myopathy, myositis, can lead to rhabdomyolysis.
Obviously the AHA, ACC, and NIH's NHLBI thought it was relevant.

>
>> Or is it just newsgroup posters you attempt to intimidate, so others
>> won't post about adverse effects? Is someone worried about adverse
>
> No. In fact I often agree with them.
>
>> effects metrics in the ng trolling that pharmcos do, per BJM?
>> http://bmj.bmjjournals.com/cgi/content/full/330/7504/1347-a?ehom
>>
>> Why are you actively trying to discourage a free and open discussion,
>> just because it addresses statin side effects? Is there some bonus for
>> keeping the numbers low in the hits returned by the pharmco webcrawlers?
>>
>
> Please provide proof of your claim.
>
> For the record statins can have adverse effects and I have said that many
> times before.
>
>> Jason was not addressing the rarity of rhabdomyolysis in the normal
>> non-statin using population. Nor was Jason addressing the rarity of
>> rhabdomyolysis in the general statin-using population. Jason was
>> addressing the danger of potential rhabdomyolysis in a patient already
>> exhibiting statin myopathy.
>
>
> Myopathy is common. Rhabdomyolysis is rare. So do you think it is common
> in people with myopathy? Provide a source for that. Also, has there ever
> been a case of Rhabdomyolysis in a patient with a non-elevated CK level?
>
>>Rhabdo, by the way IS a result of statin myopathy.
>>
>> It is quite reasonable to assume that there is enough of a chance for a
>> paitient who is already exhibiting statin myopathy to go into
>> rhabomyolysis, however rare it is in the general population.
>
> What do mean by "enough"? and what evidence do you have?
>
>> Did you also chastize the AHA, NHLBI and ACC for warning about the danger
>> of muscle pain?
>>
>
> You already asked that and I answerd it. I assume they were unbiased in
> their warnings. I have also warned about it.
>
>> After all, even Scott Grundy, the all-time statin cheerleader and
>> apologist, and acceptor of funding from all statin pharmcos, himself
>> wrote the following in the
>> ACC/AHA/NHLBI Clinical Advisory
>>
>> on the Use and Safety of Statins
>>
>> :
>>
>> "If the patient experiences muscle soreness, tenderness, or
>> pain, with or without CK elevations, rule out common
>>
>> causes such as exercise or strenuous work. Advise moderation
>>
>> in activity for persons who experience these symptoms
>>
>> during combination therapy.
>>
>> Discontinue statin therapy (or statin and niacin or fibrate
>>
>> if the patient is on combination therapy) if a CK greater
>>
>> than 10 times the ULN is encountered in a patient with
>>
>> muscle soreness, tenderness, or pain.
>>
>> If the patient experiences muscle soreness, tenderness, or
>>
>> pain with either no CK elevation or a moderate elevation (3
>>
>> to 10 times the ULN), follow the patient's symptoms and
>>
>> CK levels weekly until there is no longer medical concern or
>>
>> symptoms worsen to the situation described previously (at
>>
>> which point therapy should be discontinued). For patients
>>
>> who develop muscle discomfort and/or weakness and who
>>
>> also have progressive elevations of CK on serial measurements,
>>
>> either a reduction of statin dose or a temporary
>>
>> discontinuation may be prudent. A decision can then be
>>
>> made whether or when to reinstitute statin therapy."
>>
>>
>
> I agree with all of that.
>
>> What possible reason could you have to attempt to intimidate the
>> reasonable discussion about a common concern?
>>
>
> I don't have any.
>
>> What makes you think that your biased and slanted and entirely irrational
>> opinion of Dr. Cohen's fine book is of interest here?
>
> I have said very little about the book. So it should be very easy to show
> where I have provided biased and slanted and etirely irrattional opinions.
>
> Please demonstrate this. Or be shown once again to be a liar.

check this thread, that came from you to Jason regarding Dr. Cohen's book.

>
>
>> Who designated you as the official mind reader of top-selling physicians
>> who just might be answering a large public outcry and need to know as
>> 'bad mouthing'?
>>
> No one. Are you a volunteer?

check this thread, that came from you to Jason regarding Dr. Cohen's book.

>
>> Seems you may have mistaken a look in the mirror for the back cover of
>> Dr. Cohen's EXCELLENT book.
>>
>>
>
> You continue to just engauge in downgrading others but doing absolutely
> nothing to support your case.

There is an 80-page FAQ on Statin Adverse Effects on the web for all to see,
that I created and maintain to support my case. What is your response to
the study findings in that FAQ?

http://www.freewebs.com/stopped_our_statins/StatinFAQ_031305wTOCv4.pdf


>
> Bill
>
>>
>> "Bill" <xxx@xxxxx> wrote in message
>> news:Igwqe.9359$_A5.5095@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>
>>> "Jason" <jason@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
>>> news:jason-1006051301500001@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>
>>>> I continue to learn more and more about statins as a result of this
>>>> book:
>>>>
>>>> "What You Must Know about Statin Drugs and their Natural Alternatives"
>>>> by Jay S. Cohen, M.D.
>>>>
>>>> I encourage you to buy it if you take statins.
>>>>
>>>> One question came up about a week ago in this newsgroup. I will now
>>>> attempt to answer that question.
>>>>
>>>> Someone posted a message indicating that they stopped taking statins as
>>>> a
>>>> result of muscle pains but planned to start taking the same statins at
>>>> the
>>>> same dosage levels since her chol. levels were really high.
>>>>
>>>> The question that was asked was:
>>>> What will happen to this person if she keeps taking the statins for
>>>> several years while having muscle pains during those same several
>>>> years?
>>>>
>>>> I have downloaded reports from the medlineplus web site related to
>>>> Rhabdomyolysis and Acute Tubular Necrosis
>>>>
>>>> Two of the symptoms of Rhabdomyolysis are MUSCLE STIFFNESS or ACHING
>>>> (myalgia).
>>>> Two the symptoms of Acute Tubular Necrosis are JOINT PAIN AND FLANK
>>>> PAIN.
>>>>
>>>> Such a person could eventually develop one of these diseases. It's also
>>>> possible that this person might not ever develop any of these diseases
>>>> but
>>>> would just have to learn to live with muscle pains for as long as she
>>>> takes statins.
>>>> My advice to this person is to see your doctor and discuss options
>>>> since
>>>> your muscle pains could mean that you may develop one of the diseases
>>>> mentioned above.
>>>> I am not a doctor or a medical expert.
>>>> I welcome your comments.
>>>> Jason
>>>>
>>>
>>> You make it sound like there is a reasonable chance of getting
>>> Rhabdomyolysis.
>>>
>>> To be objective you should point out that it is pretty rare.
>>>
>>> Also, it is not true that muscle pain never goes away for any patient.
>>>
>>> Also, why are you asking this? You come across as trying to bad mouth
>>> statins as much as possible without actually lying. Which is what the
>>> author of the book was doing on the back cover as I pointed out.
>>>
>>> Bill
>>>> --
>>>> NEWSGROUP SUBSCRIBERS MOTTO
>>>> We respect those subscribers that ask for advice or provide advice.
>>>> We do NOT respect the subscribers that enjoy criticizing people.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>


.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: Statins, CoQ10 and CRP
    ... and this increased my muscle soreness. ... Obtain a CK measurement if the patient reports suggestive muscle symptoms, ... Discontinue statin therapy (or statin and niacin or fibrate if the patient ... Rhabdomyolysis is destruction of muscle with elevations of CK along with ...
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    ... The muscle pain from a statin can continue to increase ... his CK measurements increase to just below rhabdomyolysis level for a full ...
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  • Re: Additional Info. about statins
    ... >>> of muscle pain? ... > Statin muscle damage, myopathy, myositis, can lead to rhabdomyolysis. ... >> a case of Rhabdomyolysis in a patient with a non-elevated CK level? ...
    (sci.med.cardiology)
  • Re: Additional Info. about statins
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  • Re: Additional Info. about statins
    ... >> serious statin adverse effects, ... >>> Bill, ... >>> the danger of potential rhabdomyolysis in a patient already exhibiting ... NHLBI and ACC for warning about the danger of muscle pain? ...
    (sci.med.cardiology)