Re: CK blood test


"Sharon Hope" <shope@xxxxxxxx> wrote in message
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>
> "Bill" <xxx@xxxxx> wrote in message
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>>
>> "Sharon Hope" <shope@xxxxxxxx> wrote in message
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>>>>>>>>> "Robert" <Robertitsme@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
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>>>>>>>>>> http://jnnp.bmjjournals.com/cgi/content/full/68/6/750
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> http://www.gpnotebook.co.uk/cache/-415956920.htm
>>>>>>>>>>
> <snip>
>>> The relevance is that you should ask an expert.
> <snip>
>>> Horses, not zebras. Obviously if the patient is taking a known myotoxic
>>> and neurotoxic substance, that would be the first place to look.
>>>
>>
>> What you said was the most likely cause was statins. You have yet to
>> support that. For your statement to be true the number of false positives
>> must be low. And you have yet to show that it is.
>
> If a patient is being administered a known myotoxic drug and exhibits muscle
> damage, suspect the myotoxic drug first.
>


Which has absoultely nothing to do with the question. You are again changing
the subject. Again if the the CK test comes back positive you claimed this was
most likely due to statin damage in a statin taker. I challenged you to
provide a source for this and you have not. You just keep reasserting your
original claim over and over - but give not explaination as to why it is true.
I gave you an example of something that could be more frequent - false
positives. Why could this not be more frequent? Answer this directly without
changing the question.


> Statins are proven to be myotoxic, per citations below.
>

You are again bringing up irrelavent issues. No one claimed they were not. So
why does your showing that they are prove anything? Why do you keep going off
and proving something I have already agreed to?

> If a patient is being administered a drug known to cause cognitive damage
> and exhibits cognitive damage, suspect the cognitively damaging drug first.
>
> Statins are proven to be cognitively damaging, per citations below.
>
> If a patient is being administered a known neurotoxic drug and exhibits
> neurological damage, suspect the neurotoxic drug first.
>
> Statins are proven to be neurotoxic, per citations below.
>
> Excerpts from the Statin Adverse Effects FAQ, regarding the three most
> common adverse effects from Lipitor (aka Atorvastatin), Lescol (aka
> fluvastatin), Mevacor (aka lovastatin), Pravachol (aka pravastatin), Zocor
> (aka simvastatin), Crestor (aka rosuvastatin), or Baycol (aka cerivastatin).
>
> Note that the full FAQ contains citations for studies that establish other
> adverse effects in addition to muscle damage, cognitive damage and nerve
> damage.
> Full FAQ:
> http://www.freewebs.com/stopped_our_statins/StatinFAQ_031305wTOCv4.pdf
>
-snip-

You have left out the issue of your claim that a person with muscle pain
should:

"expect the muscle pain and damage to continue for months to years before
subsiding."

but we have this:

"Many of the myopathic patients had felt markedly improved when they stopped
their statin therapy for two weeks before entry into the trial. "

from Dr. Phillips site

and this from Dr. Golomb's site

"Although symptoms usually resolve on stopping the drug, for a
proportion of those who have contacted us, muscle symptoms - pain or
weakness - or peripheral neuropathy may persist when the drugs are
discontinued."


which does not imply that for most people the symptoms linger.

When I asked you to justify your claim you could only point to your
recollection of a talk you attended. When I asked you to provide some details
from that talk -e.g. how many people had little or no symptoms at two months -
you declined. So you have essentially provided no evidence to support your
claim and I have provided some that contradicts it.

Bill




.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: CK blood test
    ... suspect the myotoxic drug first. ... > claimed this was most likely due to statin damage in a statin taker. ... >> Statins are proven to be myotoxic, ... >> If a patient is being administered a drug known to cause cognitive damage ...
    (sci.med.cardiology)
  • Re: Pravachol verses Lipitor ?
    ... > Steve Marcus wrote: ... >> tens of thousands who can, do and benefit from statins. ... suffered any damage at all. ... Every statin drug comes with a list of side ...
    (sci.med.cardiology)
  • Re: CK blood test
    ... If a patient is being administered a known myotoxic drug and exhibits muscle ... Statins are proven to be myotoxic, ... If a patient is being administered a drug known to cause cognitive damage ... What are the Lipitor Averse Events reported in patients treated with Lipitor ...
    (sci.med.cardiology)
  • Re: Campaign launched against dietary supplements
    ... >> prevents muscle damage from statins. ... >> but that's usually when the patient takes too much Tylenol. ... >> to those dietary supplements which are drugs, ...
    (sci.med.nutrition)
  • Re: Pravachol verses Lipitor ?
    ... eh Steve, ... "Again, for every person who cannot tolerate statins, there are ... > suffered any damage at all. ... Every statin drug comes with a list of side ...
    (sci.med.cardiology)
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