Re: CRP and HIV


"Pramesh Rutajit" <p2976221tongue@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:1353643.HZ3AP8jEvV@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Robert wrote:
>
> >
> > "Pramesh Rutajit" <p2976221tongue@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
> > news:1354964.UTkQUtSzfl@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >> miscellaneousmedia@xxxxxxxxx wrote:
> >
> >> Cardiovascular disease, arthritis, obesity, diet, others.
> >>
> >> Go to Amazon.com (or another books store) and do a search for
> >> inflammation
> >> and pick of well reviewed book. They will cover some of the causes and
> >> give you some ideas about solutions. Most likely your physician will
not
> >> have a clue about how to lower CRP or what to look for as the cause.
It
> >> doesn't fit into the standard assembly line client care process.
> >
> > Bizarre statement Pramesh. CRP is a diagnostic laboratory test that is
> > only orderable by a medical doctor. A doctor does not order a test he
> > knows nothing about otherwise he would not have ordered it.
>
> Perhaps, but I haven't found a doctor that tests hs-CRP,

I don't test my HsCRP and the context of the question was not HsCRP but CRP
and HIV.
Don't don't order things that are useless. If the person is so worried about
proinflammatory conditions they should treat such conditions such as
metabolic syndrome or obesity.

let alone tries to
> treat the cause.

? You have it backwards. Conditions are treated and thus they must be
diagnosed. You don't treat laboratory tests. An elevated CRP is not a
diagnosis.

As someone who has had a heart attack and four stents
> placed (a full bypass would have happened immediately if I had had
> insurance), I went out and ordered my own hs-CRP, homocysteine, LP(a), and
> VAP test and a few others.
Why? Some tests are only predictors of disease. They are intended in
predicting someone who doesn't have overt disease yet. The purpose is in
preventing heart attacks. Once you have heart disease then forget about
predicting the risk of developing heart disease as you already have it.
The role of the test now become one of monitoring therapy and not predicive
in nature.

My first two cardiologests were effectively
> clueless and had never ordered these tests before, didn't know how to
order
> them, nor thought them of any use.

A board certified Cardiologist? Maybe they had no desire of using predictive
risk assessment on a patient with known heart disease. It is 100%.
The good thing about doctors who don't know about a certain test is that
they don't order it and thus do not rely on it for making decisions.
>
> For me, my hs-CRP was 0.25, not bad. Homocysteine was 17.5, very high,
and
> I was already taking for months before the test B6 125 mg/day, B12 5000
> mcg/day, Folate 3200 mcg/day, and TMG 500 mg/day. Beyond what I was
> already doing, I haven't had a doctor since that has had anything to add
on
> how to address it.
Your lab tests are meaningless as you already have heart disease. The same
treatment exists for all patients with heart disease regarless of origin. It
is questionable whether reducing homocyteine will change anything as the
jury is still out.

The VAP test showed small partical LDL which statins do
> not treat and untreated will certain speed up restenosis. Granted,
> restenosis is more profitable for cardiologests so their incentive to
> prevent it is not outstanding.

Statin therapy didn't reduce your LDL? One checks for that after therapy
obviously and if you look at the gene connection below mestioned by listener
it is genetically determined and again questionable.
>
> Hence, any text on inflammation is going make any run-of-the-mill persion
> more informed on the subject than 99% of most doctors.

You have a distorted view that concentrates only on HsCRP. CRP's is an acute
phase reactant that is generated through cytokine interactions. The only
difference between HsCRP and CRP is not so much the reagent as it is the
same reagent but in terms of calibration with a slight prolongation of
reaction time.
This allows for descretion of 0.05 vs the 0.1 intervals of detection of the
normal CRP. CRP's are sensitive and change within hours.

An informed person
> gets better medical care AND doctors get out of sorts because assembly
line
> medical treatment is going to get questioned. People are NOT statistical
> averages.

I don't know what you mean by an informed person gets better medical care.
An informed person gets the medical care he feels he is happy with. I don't
know if that means better in the absolute sense. People are subjective for
good reason. If they want a procedure done then they will seek out a doctor
who does it and say that they got better care. If a doctor suggests a
procedure be done and that person doesn't want to do it then they go to
another doctor who agrees with that person and he then suggests that he was
better served by that doctor and the other doctors only wanted money for
doing the surgery. Did both get better care? Maybe not in terms of
statistics as you suggest that people are not statistical averages but in
terms of living with something they can live with then both did get better
care. Take a neutral patient who doesn't really care about options and
relies solely on the doctor for that advice and see if he got better medical
care. He would say yes because he accepts the problems or complications as a
part of normal life and flows with the punches.
>
> > Last I heard medicine is not practiced by Amazon.com or is learned by
> > reading a well reviewed book. It doesn't work that way and your
> > interpretation is way over the line about assembly line clinical care.
>
> My experiences is that assembly line care is the norm.

There is nothing wrong with assymbly line care as most government programs
are exactly that. Most patients are happy in allowing the doctors make all
the decisions. Other patients are more neurotic and seek second, third or
fourth opinions until they find something they like.

So far, 5 out of 5
> doctors don't think that small particle LDL is a problem worth treating

There is no good way to treat small LDL particle size as most of that is
genetic.

> since it doesn't fit the assembly line process. With all my coronary
> arteries 98% blocked at the age of 45, I unhumbly disagree.

I would venture to say that at my age 54, and being the youngest of 6 all of
which are still alive and with extended family members with zero heart
disease living into their eighties, genetics plays a big role in which diet
plays very little.
Not enough is known about genetic modifiers.
The context again was HIV and CRP.



.

Relevant Pages

  • State of the Union: Affordable and Accessible Health Care
    ... Comprehensive Agenda To Make Health Care In America More Affordable, ... should have begun with the family doctor - the overated, ... money by seeing a good nurse for our primary care instead of the ... Many Patients Prefer Nurses To Doctors ...
    (alt.politics.bush)
  • Health care
    ... This is about medical care that my wife Marilyn received here in Las ... As of this time the center, and doctor Desai are under investigation, he ... After a bit of a wait the doctor enters with a nurse. ...   We arrive at the clinic a little earlier than she is scheduled. ...
    (soc.senior.issues)
  • Health care
    ... This is about medical care that my wife Marilyn received here in Las ... As of this time the center, and doctor Desai are under investigation, he ... After a bit of a wait the doctor enters with a nurse. ...   We arrive at the clinic a little earlier than she is scheduled. ...
    (soc.senior.issues)
  • Re: ot: health care- drawing the line and controlling costs
    ... at least only want to limit some care... ... if I had followed the advice of a doctor it would have been the wrong ... responsibility for themselves and do not blindly follow a doctor's orders? ... plan he decided on. ...
    (comp.sys.mac.advocacy)
  • Re: Bad and Dishonest Doctors
    ... In other words, you blame doctors, jews, whites and preacherfor your ... > I was born with Peripheral Artery Disease; ... > SyndromeJewish ancestry - and kidney disease (mother's ... Maybe the doctor let them know ...
    (misc.health.diabetes)