Re: Steere/Yale MAJOR screw-up.

From: A_Weisman (a_weisman_at_yahoo.com)
Date: 07/17/04 

Date: 17 Jul 2004 04:20:46 -0700

GregGerber@hotmail.com (Greg Gerber) wrote in message news:<146041df.0407161845.57340880@posting.google.com>...
> yes, he is responsible for the influence of his own words, and I am
> sure he would be the first to agree.

Well one thing is for damned sure.

He is NOT responsible for people misinterpreting his words or not even
reading what he has written.

So when greatCLOD says that since PCPs don't bother to read the fulla
article and seize on something like "bullseye rash" and ignore where
Steere says that there are many variations of the rash and the rash
occurs in only 40-60% of cases which is what ALL the early literature
said (early until the later 1990s), well that is NOT Steere's fault.

YES he is responsible for saying that if it isn't cured by a few weeks
of antibiotics it is NOT Lyme but is chronic fatigue or fibromyalgia.
And YES he is responsible for what he said.

As to how much influence he has had, well that wasn't up to him, that
was up to others.

I think George Bush is an idiot and a nazi. And I blame him for his
actions. But I blame the 50 million morons who voted for him in the
first place too. It was them who gave him so much power.

I'm very troubled by the notion that you and der dritte mann seem to
be endorsing the idea that Allen Steere should be disciplined by a
medical board for offering his opinion and for the fact that others
have agreed with him IF THAT IS WHAT YOU'RE SAYING????

I absolutely think that anyone who was misdiagnosed by him or
mistreated by him has a legitimate complaint. But to urge people to
make complaints against Steere because their doctor agreed with him
and followed his guidelines? That is I think a VERY dangerous
proposition.

Should Burrascano be responsible for the doctors who follow his
guidelines? When he hasn't seen their patients or consulted or their
cases?

Listen by endorsing this notion there is a whole new area of liability
created. Now people aren't responsible for what they have done but
what others do based on offering their opinions not on a specific case
but as a general matter?

The chilling effect this would have on first amendment expression and
the marketplace of ideas is frightening. Should there be no academic
discourse? Should people not have the right to offer their opinions?
Including opinions that are WRONG?

Steere has a right to his opinion. So does Burrascano. The idea that
either should be disciplined for their opinions alone is something I
think is not only wrong but many steps down the road to intellectual
and actual fascism and I oppose it.

I hope that is what either one of you is saying. And if not, well THAT
is the point I'm TRYING to make here. Maybe I haven't been making it
clearly.

And though it is annoying to have to keep saying it FOR THE RECORD I
don't agree with (most) of Steere's conclusions and views about the
diagnosis and treatment of Lyme disease. And I would NEVER choose him
as my doctor or choose a doctor who subscribed to Steere's theories
much less a doctor who hadn't even bothered to read the details and
distinguished the nuances from the generalities.

But I think Steere has every right to his opinions. And so does
Burrascano. And patients should have a right to choose either one and
after being fully informed of risks and benefits make their own choice
between Steere style treatment and Burrascano style treatment in the
context of their own therapeutic alliance with the doctor of their
choice. I don't think medical boards should be dictating the
treatment--EITHER treatment particularly at this time when much more
is unknown than known. That means I don't think Burrascano style
treatment should be mandated either. I think patients and their
doctors should be able to choose freely between short term and long
term treatment after being informed of ALL the risks and benefits.

That doesn't mean I think patients should be able to choose ICHT. That
is over the line. The known risks outweigh the dubious benefits.

But antibiotics are antibiotics. And Lyme is Lyme. Some people only
seem to need short term antibiotics. And some seem to need much
longer. And I think patients can make that choice in conjunction with
their doctors and I don't understand how it should be a basis for
discipline.

But the idea that Steere should be disciplined because other doctors
agree with him or think they agree with him when they haven't even
read what he's written?

Well if that standard is applied it has to be applied to llmds too.
And llmds wouldn't like that. And neither would their patients.
Particularly when we're talking about holding them responsible for
others MISreading what they've written.

So Burrascano advocates long term and sometimes high dose treatment.
He also advocates monitoring for liver function and other side
effects.

If a "llmd" uses long term treatment a la burrascano but fails to
monitor, is burrascano responsible for that? Of course not.

If a "steere" devotee sees no bullseye and says it can't be Lyme, is
Steere responsible? No since Steere doesn't say ANYWHERE that the
absence of a classic bullseye means no Lyme.

If a doctor gives two doses of doxy to a patient infected six months
ago, is Durland Fish responsible? NO of course not since his article
only says it works (for some percentage of patients in the study) when
given within 72 hours of tickbite and rash. And Fish went on the
record when the article came out expressing his concerns about its
possible misuse or misinterpretation.

I don't know. I really hope that the two of you whom I respect aren't
saying differently. If so I just give up entirely.

I hope it was that I didn't make myself clear about the philosophical
point about resposnbility I was trying to make.

Relevant Pages

  • by Deborah Franklin. Patient Power: Making Sure Your Doctor Really Hears You.
    ... Health Care Policy ... Making Sure Your Doctor Really Hears You ... The power gap often shuts patients down. ... Getting the Best Treatment," published this year. ...
    (sci.med)
  • by Deborah Franklin. Patient Power: Making Sure Your Doctor Really Hears You.
    ... Health Care Policy ... Making Sure Your Doctor Really Hears You ... The power gap often shuts patients down. ... Getting the Best Treatment," published this year. ...
    (sci.med.dentistry)
  • Re: Pain and Human Development/ question of ethics 4 Hawki
    ... >This is all truly good news for all of us pain patients Hawki. ... >that the doctor is leaving, and there is no one whom they can refer ... another Dr who is willing to continue the established treatment plan. ...
    (alt.support.chronic-pain)
  • Re: Shakedown time(rather long)
    ... example of not being passive patients. ... Why should it be different with any doctor ... that you can talk to and that you can get respectful treatment ... Nanny and that you and none of us ever settle for less again.--fran ...
    (alt.med.fibromyalgia)
  • Re: Dr. Steere
    ... >> this diagnosis actually have Lyme Disease. ... I know that Dr A. Steere is the top specialist in Lyme ... Stalking Dr. Steere Over Lyme Disease ... researchers and rheumatologists, began to fear patients. ...
    (sci.med.diseases.lyme)