Re: The LDA is wrong about the IDSA Guidelines


magruder wrote:

Joel, the two tiered testing is meant for arthritis
patients. ELISA captures the high antibody response
of arthritis,

Thank you, Kathleen, for at least not responding with insults.

But I must tell you AGAIN, that I really, REALLY am NOT Joel. (I
absolutely swear upon pain of death, my mother's life, etc, etc).

It's just not me.

(And I am not "Jewish" or a "Jew", either. Really. So, if you are
trying to hurt me with that...it isn't working and you are just hurting
yourself and your own credibility with that. I wish you would stop.
Please).

Honestly, from what I have read, though, I worry more about others
believing that more for the injury it may do to Joel's reputation.
Seems to me, he has written some very insightful pieces. In other
words, I don't consider myself to be at his level of understanding.

Admittedly, as I have said many times, I do not have a technical
background. I don't think it means I am incapable of understanding,
though, necessarily.

THEN you supposedly do the Western blot to see
if *borrelia* are causing the inflammatory response
or the high antibody response.

Well, I am really trying to address here how the various entities apply
the constructs here...and really not attempting to debate their
scientific validity.

I think the issues here are over just correctly interpreting what is
actually meant by the IDSA...and NOT over whether what is meant is
scientifically valid or not. I leave that to you...I don't consider
myself competent to engage in that type of analysis.


Yes, IDSA fully disclaim their guidelines.

Well, I am a lawyer, though, or used to be one, at least...and I will
tell you that is smart on their part. I see that as necssary and
customary and not particularly ominous in any way.

But saying that these guidelines are not substitutes for sound clinical
judgment and are voluntary in nature really is more of what might be
though of as a sort of framework for proper perspective...how to view
them in proper persective.

You can't, in my opinion, just dismiss that as being a "disclaimer".
Disclaimers have to be interpreted to mean what they say, in other
words. You are supposed to give terms their "plain and ordinary
meaning".

If someone wants to suggest that something really means something other
than what it says on its face, then they have to prove through other
evidence what was actually intended.

Still looks to me as though they meant to say that "clinical
discretion" is very much intact.

Did you hear Klempner say he found the HLA haplotype
HLA-DQB1*0602 in a very high percentage of "seronegative"
patients.

Yes. And I have heard the audio also...(courtesy of yourself, I
believe).

Don't waste your time with Pat's statements, you know
better than that.

Well, it sort of looks to me as though the LDA now is sort of emerging
as the dominant factor in the patient community...that the LDF is
slowly waning in influence.

It looks to me as if they really blew this one...bigtime...and that
sort of has consequences for their credibility as a patient advocate.
Whoever is responsible for this...

Why do you bother?

Oh hell, I don't really know... to tell you the honest-to-god truth.

(You know...damned interesting question...thanks for asking).

And...as long as we are sort of almost communicating here...I will say
that I almost agree with a post you put up the other day about a Duray,
Dorward study (I think it was) that showed cyst forms in tissue...

....at least that it POTENTIALLY has great signifigance.

I don't think, however, it necessarily invalidates the current state
of the art, though, as I think you suggested.

But, yeah, the IDSA people managed to overlook that and similar
material. There are, I think, certainly problems there...with the IDSA
stuff, I mean...mostly with what they did NOT say in regard to
persistence issues.

.

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