Re: steere/dressler part 1

ooohh...I forgot...first of all {I apologize} can you remind me of your
question wrt clinical diagnosis? it sort of got lost in the clouds of
my mind.

also..wrt steere..it's obvious that he's paranoid and scared, this
being inferred from his NY times interview. But I would like to say
that I agree, he can give the best answers for his behavior.

so I would like to suggest that he give a special speech/question and
answer session, perhaps along with some of his fellow IDSA/ALDF
scientists, including CDC and NIH, and explain their views to the
world. it can be held in a high security environment, given his obvious
fears over the lyme crazies, justified or not. it could even be done
over the internet through a special chat on the IDSA site. there are
all sorts of things he and IDSA could do to ameliorate the problems wrt
angry lyme patients and advocates who have questions about these
studies and policies.

the ramrod approach is a very bad idea, as it magnifies dissension and
it probably increases the possibility that some desparate idiot will go
on a shooting spree, or something awful like that. sometimes I wonder
if that is what they WANT...someone to go nuts and kill or try to kill
an IDSA doc out of anger and frustration at the brutal ramrod approach.
if that happened, IDSA would be granted an incredible PR victory as it
would justify to the public at large the view of lymies as delusional
nuts. So, I would hope that any lyme patient reading this and
contemplating such a desparate stupid act would realize that not only
would such an act be illegal, it would additionally be crippling to the
lyme advocacy movement and would accomplish nothing but misery and
destruction for everyone involved and every issue they cared about.

why don' t they {IDSA} go public and answer questions openly? many
problems could be solved...gaps could be bridged...etc. in fact, IDSA
could simply collect the pressing questions and publish a pamphlet in
which IDSA docs provided detailed answers. that would avoid the
possibility of someone being rudely shouted down in person by an angry
lyme patient. hell, that pamphlet alone would probably net a good buck,
in addition to calming the anger of the herd.

they would be much better off directly broaching these subjects and
candidly addressing them, rather than depending on hiring lawyers and
PR firms to form a wall between them and the ugly reality.




the 3rd Man wrote:
jim nasium wrote:

wrt to the "cross-reactivity" issue...that information was already
known from other studies.and in any event, the retrospective study
which was used to determine the guidelines for a CDC serologic
diagnostic protocol is not the appropriate place to perform such a
study, because it will unavoidably cloud the results, among others of
dozens of reasons.

What was "already known"? From what other studies? (Remember you are
talking about cross-reaction across the VDRL and the Lyme tests...two
separate considerations, if I understand properly).

Why is that not an appropriate place to see how the test performs
against known syphilis subjects, where you would expect a possible
cross-reaction? Isn't that what you need to know?
How the test performs? How accurate it is?

You want to gauge how accurate this test is, right? How it performs
against possible 'false-positives"?

I'm not arguing whether this happened or not, I just asked if this
wasn't a logical explanation for why that was done.

uh, we've asked steere questions directly before and he dodges the
question. it's a waste of time.

Uh...who, exactly are "we"? And when was this done...and what was the
answer?

But I think you are missing the essential point...(or I wasn't
explaining it well).

You simply can't sit in a closet and infer what someone else might have
done. I mean, fine, you have your conclusions that you have reached.

Before I make any sort of judgment, I want to hear what Steere says
about it. And that is a rule that I think intelligent people utilize to
resolve disputes and confusion.

You know, many times you file a case thinking you have a dead-bang
winner...only to sit down and take the defendant's deposition and find
out you have a complete and total loser.

That's what I mean.

You don't just draw your conclusions from hearing one side of the
story. Not if you have a brain in your head.

So, I want to know what Steere says about why he did that. Don't you?
Don't you want to know?


What about the issue of 41 appearing in control groups? Has that been
observed in multiple control groups as Carl Brenner suggested?

(You owe me an answer on my clinical diagnosis bit, also, please. I
would appreciate your reply. I am responding to you. Simply, do you
have any disagreement with what I said there)?

.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: steere/dressler part 1
    ... over the internet through a special chat on the IDSA site. ... really the only sort of arena where I would expect you to see that. ... I would hope that any lyme patient reading this and ... professionals. ...
    (sci.med.diseases.lyme)
  • Re: What does "LLMD" REALLY stand for?
    ... I have been sort of forced to try to reveal more of my personal fight ... to sort of rebut attacks on my legitimacy. ... so certain that I was in the employ of the IDSA, ...
    (sci.med.diseases.lyme)
  • Re: Sigal--"clinical diagnosis"
    ... Well, you can STILL properly reach an appropriate clinical diagnosis, ... And what in the hell makes them think the IDSA can over-rule the CDC, ...
    (sci.med.diseases.lyme)
  • Re: Spinning and distorting the truth
    ... is that in my opinion they are just giving the IDSA ammo to ... sue for defamation, even though I highly doubt they would do it. ... it is theoretically possible that a defamation suit could be brought. ... Usually a sort of gentleman's agreement ...
    (sci.med.diseases.lyme)
  • Re: IDSA Guidelines...can anyone tell me what this means?
    ... The IDSA guidelines state exactly ... what LDA suggests on this issue, to wit, that clinical diagnosis refers ... of the meaning that is spelled out in detail in the body of the text. ...
    (sci.med.diseases.lyme)